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Staredit Network -> Serious Discussion -> Is Artificial Intelligence possible?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rhiom on 2005-10-01 at 05:59:07
QUOTE(Ego @ Sep 23 2005, 01:31 PM)
Everything in the program is, well, programmed.  It will always do what the programmer says, without variation.  If you want to call that intelligence, fine, but it's not.
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If this statement wre true then it could be argued that no human ever was intellegent becuase they only did that there gentic program had developed for them and therefore werent being intellegent but isntead were being a mindless drone of their genes...

I think the problem isn't a problem of capacity or speed, computers will always get faster and faster, smaller and smaller (with in reason), and always able to store more. (not meanen all of these literally, sense there probably is a limit, but if their is then it is either as great as or greater then the human mind). In my mind there is no doubt that computer will catch up with the complexities of the human mind, the question of artificial intellegence lies in more philisophical/ religiuse terms for me.

If you conclude that human's are without a soul (or special energy, free will, call it what u will) and are only basicly really really advance organic computer which run programs in the form of genetic information, and exchanged electrons, then artificial intellegence as smart as a human/ better is quite possible. if on the other hand you conclude that all humans have this extra element that gives them free will/ a soul (whatever u wish to call it) that gives them a extra ability to make decisions, to learn, and to make truely intellegent decisions, then no A.I. isnt possible without further exploration into the depths of what make humans have this soul/ free will. because if this is the key element to human intellegent then no machine could possibly have it unless it's further exlpored.

so whether or not A.I. is possible? it all depends on whether or not u think what makes humans unique is that fact that they ahve a soul.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by PwnPirate on 2005-10-01 at 17:49:54
QUOTE
You can make a program that wont listen to the user.
AI in starcraft, for example. Type 'Stop'.
Does it stop?

That isn't Artificial Intelligence
That's Artificial Stupidity


Also, it's not the computer learning, its the computer doing a mirror image, if we made a computer with Artificial Intelligence it would just know what we know and nothing more, because we can't program what we don't know, that's like, killing an animal that's not there.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by PlayaR on 2005-10-07 at 22:05:19
wow....
unbelieveable how the No answering is owning all the other answer 50 to whatever blink.gif
and theres like only 22 posts to go with it
plus theres not alot of views just 212
just very suprising how that is pool in turning out to be
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Syphon on 2005-10-08 at 18:34:43
QUOTE(Shadow-Killa_04 @ Sep 28 2005, 12:32 AM)
This is a very complicated question. Its possible, but not yet at the very least. You see, computers cannot come up with completly random numbers. They come up with suedo random numbers which are so random, we could never really tell the difference, but until  we can find a way that it can actualy come up with a number 100% randomly, complete artifical intellegence is not possible.

So the question is, will we ever be able to make it come up with a 100% random number? Well, that is a question which obvisouly the answer so far is no to. Computer follow steps in order. Thats the way we programmed them. We would literaly have to recreate the computer if we wanted AI.
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People can't come up with just completely random numbers either. Whenever you're asked for one you're always influenced by something. very rarely does a true "random number" occur.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rantent on 2005-10-10 at 11:51:37
Artificial intellegence could be made if we were to make a computer that could renetwork its interior, this renetworking is the basis of learning in the brain. Mimicing it would be somewhat of a task though.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by PlayaR on 2005-10-10 at 13:32:56
i say i dumb....because i dont really get this Artificial intellegence stuff much >.<
any1 wanna explain to me what the meaning of the Artificial intellegence stuff in a breif summary? it would really be helpfull lol
Report, edit, etc...Posted by illusion(SS) on 2005-10-10 at 13:46:58
hmmm.
i had a really wierd thought.

what if, someone designed a program that ran on the computer, where it set up a virutal human brain envoirnment. and then it started to think, the program started to think. then, the person running the program turned it off. basically forcing you to stop thinking. like.. torture.

like, imagine a brain in a computer. a real person mind in a computer, but then a person can turn it on and off with no idea your thinking. really wierd.


also, in conjunction with what you guys are saying up there. you seem to forgot the fact that we forget things. if you made a computer that saved everything, hell yeah alot of space, and super intelligence. it has to be able to overwrite data, or lose data, or use some method of combining pices of data together to make them smaller.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Infested-Jerk on 2005-10-12 at 19:12:31
(This is one of my, I'm on topic, but off topic)


OF COURSE!!! WHAT DO YOU THINK WEIS IS?


I didn't say that did I?

Oh crud, I'll have a chee holding a dracon at me tomorrow. (Don't ask, and for shape's info, the chee touched that creepy crystal thing.)


Anyways, I bet computers will someday evolve that far. They process stuff much faster, which means eventualy, they could learn constantly. They've started making a robot make of blocks, that can become a number of other shapes, like squares, lines, ect. That may be where AI lies.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Syphon on 2005-10-12 at 20:24:53
QUOTE(EzDay281 @ Sep 27 2005, 08:47 PM)
You could just as easily say that the laws of reality are concrete, and that the entire future is already defined, there is no such thing as freewill, and there's nothing we can do about it.
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O, but they are. There is no spoon and all the jimma jammer.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by 00cnr on 2005-10-15 at 09:38:42
I think AI is very possible. We might not see it in our generations but it might come out a few later. Back in the 1800's, did you think the people living there thought that it was possible to create a machine that flew? Do you think that the thought that humans would walk on the moon? No but they did any way. With technology, almost anything can be done, including AI
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Infested-Jerk on 2005-10-15 at 17:47:08
-.-



Nice new name shapechanger.


Anyways, AI would have to be able to learn, or it would never be possible.


*Coughellimistcough*
Report, edit, etc...Posted by masterchiefxl on 2005-10-16 at 00:24:30
I belive its immposible with todays computers. Artificial intellignce CANT work with the computers of today.

all computers run off of binary, a system of ones and zeros, or true and false. that means that no matter what the computer "learns" a.k.a mirroring a sytem of true and falses, the computer will always refer to a system of numbers. the computer doesnt think "well, to get up these steps......", the computer thinks "1101010101" or somthing like that.

Now, in order to get a true intelligence in my mind, you have to get a computer to run on a 012 base, or trianary.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rantent on 2005-10-16 at 06:50:31
Were getting closer fast though.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-10-16 at 10:50:19
QUOTE
Now, in order to get a true intelligence in my mind, you have to get a computer to run on a 012 base, or trianary.


Honestly... why the heck would that make a difference?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2005-10-16 at 12:58:44
A computer does think in 1's and 0's, but today it has been simplified into variables, if statements, functions, etc.
Therefore, a crossrefencing program would be possible, just very difficult.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by FallenDreamer on 2005-10-16 at 19:39:12
QUOTE(Syphon @ Oct 8 2005, 04:34 PM)
People can't come up with just completely random numbers either. Whenever you're asked for one you're always influenced by something. very rarely does a true "random number" occur.
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What the hell is up with all this number talk? Humanity isn't based entirely on calculation. If it were, we'd be as boring as hell... Okay, let me get to my point with this. People don't always have to follow their programming. It is possible to ignore programming. You don't always need a reason to do something. You can just "do it." Nor do you even need a reason to like something, people can like stuff for the sake of liking stuff, which really isn't a reason. Humans can be random, and using mathematics to try and explain that, in my opinion, is not the best method. Numbers aren't all there is to the Intelligence.

QUOTE(Infested-Jerk @ Oct 12 2005, 05:12 PM)
(This is one of my, I'm on topic, but off topic)
OF COURSE!!! WHAT DO YOU THINK WEIS IS?
I bet computers will someday evolve that far. They process stuff much faster, which means eventualy, they could learn constantly. They've started making a robot make of blocks, that can become a number of other shapes, like squares, lines, ect. That may be where AI lies.
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Yeah, about that... they wouldn't be computers anymore, now would they? And it takes more than learning. If an entity "can" learn, what would it matter if it didn't want to learn? Just like us humans, the A.I. would need some sort of drive, a reason to go on. But if it truly held some form of sentience, it wouldn't need a real reason. It could want to, "just because." And if that were so, it would mean that the A.I. would need to have opinions, or be capable of them as a result of their randomness.

QUOTE(Syphon @ Oct 12 2005, 06:24 PM)
O, but they are. There is no spoon and all the jimma jammer.
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=\. Proven theories are still just theories. The laws may apply eternally, but with our limited senses and abilites, we will never be able to tell completely. Thought is the only concrete reality.

QUOTE(00cnr @ Oct 15 2005, 07:38 AM)
I think AI is very possible. We might not see it in our generations but it might come out a few later. Back in the 1800's, did you think the people living there thought that it was possible to create a machine that flew? Do you think that the thought that humans would walk on the moon? No but they did any way. With technology, almost anything can be done, including AI
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Uh...okay... please don't assume such things. While that is true, it proves that possibilites are still quite possible, but not definite. Until something is actually done, until someone has made some form of true A.I., you can't assume its definitely going to happen.


Alright, so here's what I think. First, I think it'd be a good idea to define "artificial." Because I don't see what the difference between a sentient product of technology and a sentient product of nature would be. They would both exist on the plane of thought, wouldn't they? Well than, that would mean that the A.I. isn't really a computer anymore. I'd say an A.I. would exist in a computer, but unlike a program. Think about it, we would have to make the A.I. in a way similiar to humans for them to truly think. I don't think it would be impossible for a true A.I. to be incapable of human error because, really now, what would the difference be? The A.I. wouldn't be a computer anymore. It wouldn't be a program. It isn't built to calculate and think 100% mathematically, and thus would be capable of what we should start calling "sentient" error. And I'd also have to say that this error is also a product of our innate randomness.

Now, as to the creation of such a thing, I'd have to say I have no clue. In my opinion, human's still don't know enough about themselves to recreate sentient thought, because thats really our only source of information. The only thing we can base these things on are ourselves, because as of yet, we are the only truely sentient creatures we know of.

As an end note, I'd like to say that I'm pretty sure the A.I. Crayak is thinking of is NOT a robot, or a computer.

and...well... that was fun.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TSoldier_Wol[f] on 2005-10-16 at 23:11:04
I don't know, that's my opinion. first of all, there is a chance that we'll get that kind of technolgy later in the future, but alot of people believe that the Earth is supposedly end in the year 2012AD I think. There are people who believe it will later on became reality though. So, I'm not quite sure though. But If I had to choice between Yes or No, then I'll pick yes.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Master-kenobi on 2005-10-19 at 01:27:39
Ok all im gonna say is that IF ppl wanted it ai would be possible but as ppl said y would humanity?

I mean I robot matrix terminater ect humanity would go from just normal work robots that can live like humans to huge military things and then once they get wepon and lear they superior say bye bye to ethor our freedom or humanity entirly

even if it was possible people would overuse them and it would end up in disaster

Goin back ont topic although its possible physicly its impossible because the government knows that its to powerful once they become self-aware(whoich would happen)
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Dr.Shotgun on 2005-10-19 at 21:01:09
I couldnt understand a word of that.
Is English your first language?

Anyways, I think its entirely possible. After all, why assume there is an upper limit to what computers can do. Most upper limits that were theorized in the past have been broken. Its simply a matter of horsepower, and there is a huge upper limit on that. Plus, I believ they learned how to integrate a microrganism with a computer chip. If we cannot do it through raw technology, than perhaps using stem cells to grow brains and then linking them to machines would work.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2005-10-19 at 21:08:29
QUOTE
the Earth is supposedly end in the year 2012AD I think

I really wanna know who the censored.gif came up with this theory so I can shoot him.
It's no better than the "OMG ALL THE COMPUTERS WILL DIE IN 2000!!!"

QUOTE
Goin back ont topic although its possible physicly its impossible because the government knows that its to powerful once they become self-aware(whoich would happen)

Of course they'd become self-aware, but what kind of wonderful friend would give it access to NUCLEAR WEAPONS?? Life is not like the movies. I'm sure they'd make sure it had little or no connections to the outside world.



I hate people who live by the knowledge they aquire through movies!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by brutetal on 2005-11-02 at 23:39:01
NEWS FLASH!!!!

They managed to put a microchip inside a part of a monkey's brain. With trainning, they got the monkey to move the robotic arm with just thinking!!!

Now just if soon enough their able to get a thinking processor of a human brain and then maybe they just have to copy someone's thought pattern and such. They just might get a AI program, but of course with 100% loyalty to Humans!!!

Here's the link: http://www.physorg.com/news7746.html
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Do-0dan on 2005-11-02 at 23:43:53
that's just programming it to do set actions, we want robots that can think on their own....but what exactly IS thinking on our own confused.gif
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2005-11-03 at 08:23:53
QUOTE
NEWS FLASH!!!!

They managed to put a microchip inside a part of a monkey's brain. With trainning, they got the monkey to move the robotic arm with just thinking!!!

Now just if soon enough their able to get a thinking processor of a human brain and then maybe they just have to copy someone's thought pattern and such. They just might get a AI program, but of course with 100% loyalty to Humans!!!


Fyi, can't have a news flash without a source.
Let's see it.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by MillenniumArmy on 2005-11-03 at 11:02:58
QUOTE(o-0 @ Nov 2 2005, 10:43 PM)
that's just programming it to do set actions, we want robots that can think on their own....but what exactly IS thinking on our own confused.gif
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Randomized variables laugh.gif

if the variable turns out to be 0, then act good
if the variable turns out to be 1, then act bad.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2005-11-03 at 16:50:19
wink.gif Hey, that's how I think
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