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Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-04-15 at 16:49:51
QUOTE(Demaris @ Apr 14 2006, 09:32 PM)

Saying that marijuana is a gateway drug is like saying being born is a gateway to being a murderer. After all, name a murderer that was NOT born. The kind of people that will do drugs like heroin and cocaine are just going to start with marijuana since that's the drug they will probably be able to get their hands on the easiest.

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I know a couple girls and their boy friends who tried weed, caught on to it (This was last September) and now they are doing coke.

Gateway drug? Yes, very yes.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Arbitrary on 2006-04-15 at 16:57:33
So a few individual cases prove it to be a rule?

...no?

I have a friend who smoked pot for years, then quit. He doesn't do any other drugs.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-04-15 at 18:30:23
QUOTE(Demaris @ Apr 14 2006, 10:32 PM)

Saying that marijuana is a gateway drug is like saying being born is a gateway to being a murderer. After all, name a murderer that was NOT born. The kind of people that will do drugs like heroin and cocaine are just going to start with marijuana since that's the drug they will probably be able to get their hands on the easiest.

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Exactly. Thanks for pointing out the obvious ^_^

QUOTE(Jammed @ Apr 15 2006, 04:33 AM)
the effect of smoking a lot of it is loss of memory. my classmate that smokes it for 3 years has very bad memory. it's a miracle that he can remember his girlfriend's name blink.gif

i doubt that alcohol companies would allow making it legal, cuz they will loose a lot of profit then.
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Uh, no. I've been smoking for four years, and I still have my memory. And the only reason alcohol is legal, is because it is embeded into our society, just like drugs are.

QUOTE(Golden-Fist @ Apr 15 2006, 07:21 AM)
Saying there are worser drugs doesn't make this one any better. I'm not 100% sure what's up with Marijuana and the whole Medical thing but as a smoking thing it's pretty bad. You might not want to jump out of a building or feel invincable but a lot of other people do (It's been shown in studies) so as a whole it's more dangerous then it is helpful.
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Way more worse drugs* wink.gif

The only reason those people feel like that, is because they are stupid. Literally. There are "classes" of pot-heads. Intelligent smokers, and non-intelligent smokers.

Intelligent smokers are the ones that smoke their whole life without getting caught, and become something with themselves.

Non-intelligent ones, are the rest of the smokers. The retards that get caught. The rejects that openly admit it. The faggots who become addicted and "need" it (They have shizty WILL POWER) And the homos who use it as an excuse to try harder drugs.

And besides. The reason it may make other people feel godly and stuff (Which I highly doubt. Pot makes you want to sit on your ass, and eat eat eat eat eat) is because different chemicals affect different people differently.

For example: Bob drinks two beers, and get's drunk. Jim has to have three shots before he can get drunk.

QUOTE(BeeR_KeG @ Apr 15 2006, 10:11 AM)
Economically, there wouldn't be much revenue for the Goverment.

The people will still sell it in the same way, privately so that nobody knows. It'll be sold and bought with cash. There's no tax paying in there because technically, it didn't happen.

Another problem is that they will be charging taxes to generally, the lower and middle classes, classes which can barely pay more taxes. If you think about it, drug dealers become drug dealers because of lack of money, it's great business, you don't pay taxes and with the proper connections, you've got great money. Now your going to tax them, making the lower classes much poorer.

Then you have US Customs in the way. Pot is generally brought into the States and sold within a short period of time. Now it has to wait, in the docks, for a few more days. A few more days waiting means a few less dollars.

You also have to consider that Drug Importers will also have to pay to import it. They'll still smugle it because it's cheaper to smugle it.

You also known that most pot comes from outside of the US. This means that it'll takes years or decades to have a big enough surplus so that it can be exported. Only by exporting the drug, can there be big profit.
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Actually, they could make a form of gas from it. Create hemp, and sell it. Regulate it, giving them taxes, ect...

Actually, if the government was to regulate it, and tax it, the punishment for selling behind their back would be outstanding; Thus, detrimenting anyone from wanting to even risk it. But of course, society is full of idiots, so a few would try to beat the system, but they would most likely get caught. And about growing it. The government could probibly give out licences to grow (For very heafty prices) and would pay the farmer for growing it. Just a thought.

But you have to look at this logically. If they were to legalize and tax Marijuanna, they could ease up on other taxes, or just get ride of certain other taxes, causing a balance.

Would you please elaborate on the US Customs? I don't exactly understand what you're trying to get at.

Actually um... Beer... They pay NOTHING to grow it. They would be getting PAYED by the government, for them selling it to the government. Or the government could even grow their own, to make it so they don't have to pay for imports. And they could [startconspiracy] make it even more potent to get everyone "addicted" (Hell, they could add addictive chemicals to it) so everyone will buy it[/endconspiracy]

How so? If they were to grow it, and sell it like Cigarettes (For a more expensive price of course) they would make BOMB cash. It kinda seems you have some propagandious thoughts within your head about this.. Try looking at it more open-mindedly? (No insult intended)

QUOTE(thien @ Apr 15 2006, 10:17 AM)
Since when does the government care about making the lower classes poorer? They seriously don't care about how rich/poor they actually are.
But if it were to be legalized they probably wouldn't try and smugle it because of the chances of getting caught. Why not just import it since it is legal now?
And finally, if it were to be legalized citizens of the U.S. wouldn't have to worry about getting caught with a farm or just a few plants in there house. They would probably mak there whole back yard a Marijuana farm. And alot more citizens would do this increasing the ammount of Marijuana in the United States.
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Hmmm... I do agree with you

QUOTE(donwano @ Apr 15 2006, 10:45 AM)
Nothing really.  But the government just wouldn't legalize it and piss it away to any age.  They'd have to set their standards like 18 is smoking age and 21 is drinking.  Kids are still gonna smoke it underage though.  Like if it was made to 18 years, I'd be breaking the law.[/NOTRIGHT]
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They would probibly make the age 21 because it's more chemically altering than cigarettes are. Just like Alcohol is.

QUOTE(Centreri @ Apr 15 2006, 11:33 AM)
I would legalize it but tell everyone how bad it is for you and everything.. some people will still 'import' it illegally to not pay taxes, as Beer said, but the government will still get profit from it. More teenagers will start smoking pot, probably creating chaos, and for a while, life would be worse then before, but when the problem will become ridiculous the government will be forced to do something about it, and guess what?

Population goes down.

Or is it just wishful thinking?

If that plot can never work, then keep it illegalized.. we don't need any more dangerous drugs that won't reduce world population and will increase the number of idiots.
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Are you on drugs? (No insult intended) Most teenagers DO smoke pot, or do drugs (Cigarettes are a form of drugs wink.gif)

And wishfull thinking.

QUOTE(TheDaddy0420 @ Apr 15 2006, 01:49 PM)
I know a couple girls and their boy friends who tried weed, caught on to it (This was last September) and now they are doing coke.

Gateway drug? Yes, very yes.
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Gateway drug? No, very no. Your friends are just pathetic. That's all there is to it. They have always wanted to try coke, but started with Pot so they could get the hookups to the coke.

For example: Before I ever tried Pot, I always wanted to try PsyloPsybin Mushrooms. I started smoking pot, and only last year, did I find a hookup for Mushrooms; Therefore, it is not a gateway drug, because I have ALWAYS wanted to try them.

Sooo, your friends are just pathetic pieces of dirt.

QUOTE(Arbitrary @ Apr 15 2006, 01:57 PM)
So a few individual cases prove it to be a rule?

...no?

I have a friend who smoked pot for years, then quit. He doesn't do any other drugs.
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Thank you! Finally, someone who understands that Pot is not addicting!

I'm not addicted to pot. I can stop if I wanted to. I don't want to, because I like the feeling it gives me. Right now, i'm on probation. I have NO cravings what so ever to go smoke it. Sure, I romance about the past experiences, but in no way am I going to go smoke it and get a dirty UA and go to jail for four months.

So it's all a matter of the persons FREE WILL.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-04-15 at 19:54:31
QUOTE
Gateway drug? No, very no. Your friends are just pathetic. That's all there is to it. They have always wanted to try coke, but started with Pot so they could get the hookups to the coke.


Kellimus, in America there are more stupid students/kids then you. Not all will have the will power you have. It may not be a gateway drug to you, but to them it is.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Stalingrad on 2006-04-15 at 20:17:36
There should be education that teaches about marijuana in schools if it is legalized, just as there are cigarette and alcohol education systems. The effects and risks. But not fear tactics like, IF YOU SMOKE MARIJUANA YOU WILL FAIL AT LIFE.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mune'R0x on 2006-04-15 at 21:05:19
QUOTE(TheDaddy0420 @ Apr 15 2006, 06:54 PM)
Kellimus, in America there are more stupid students/kids then you.  Not all will have the will power you have.  It may not be a gateway drug to you, but to them it is.
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So that means it can be and it also isn't a gateway drug. So it's not proven to be a gateway drug since about half the time it isnt' a gateway. Ha!

QUOTE(Kellimus)
Non-intelligent ones, are the rest of the smokers. The retards that get caught. The rejects that openly admit it. The faggots who become addicted and "need" it (They have shizty WILL POWER) And the homos who use it as an excuse to try harder drugs.


Which one am I, Kelli?
[/NOTRIGHT]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-04-15 at 21:18:21
No comment.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Stalingrad on 2006-04-15 at 21:37:36
^ Lolz
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-04-15 at 21:55:28
QUOTE(donwano @ Apr 15 2006, 05:04 PM)
So that means it can be and it also isn't a gateway drug.  So it's not proven to be a gateway drug since about half the time it isnt' a gateway.  Ha!

QUOTE(Kellimus)
Non-intelligent ones, are the rest of the smokers. The retards that get caught. The rejects that openly admit it. The faggots who become addicted and "need" it (They have shizty WILL POWER) And the homos who use it as an excuse to try harder drugs.


Which one am I, Kelli?
[/NOTRIGHT]
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Based on the majority are stupid, yes it is.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mune'R0x on 2006-04-15 at 22:10:43
How is it a majority? So more than half the people that try marijuana end up doing other drugs?[/NOTRIGHT]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Golden-Fist on 2006-04-15 at 23:34:25
QUOTE(Arbitrary @ Apr 15 2006, 03:57 PM)
So a few individual cases prove it to be a rule?

...no?[right][snapback]466215[/snapback][/right]

You do know the drug is still illegal right?
I read the Wikipedia on Marijuana and I found a nice long list of things that could happen from just a few smokes:
QUOTE
    * Anti-emetic properties
    * Modulation of working and short-term memory
    * Impairment of short-term memory in some users
    * Enhancement of many other drug effects (including those of alcohol, ecstasy, tobacco, heroin, cocaine)
    * Auditory or visual hallucinations at high doses in some users
    * Paramnesia, repetitiveness and ambiguation
    * Increased appetite (often referred to as "the munchies"), an effect of stimulation of the endocannabinoid system, which affects body weight, insulin resistance, and dyslipidemia.
    * Induced sense of novelty
          o Increased or decreased sexual pleasure
          o Increased awareness of sensation
          o Increased awareness of patterns and colors
          o Increased appreciation of music and other arts
    * Increased mental activity, like metacognition
    * Initial wakefulness followed by drowsiness and lassitude ('burnt out')
    * Introspective or meditative states of mind
    * Gain or loss of some inhibitions
    * Mild euphoria, feelings of general well-being
    * Relaxation or stress reduction
    * Mild tachycardia (Increased heart rate)
    * Mild, temporary dry mouth (sometimes referred to as cottonmouth, pasties, or the drys (NZ))
    * Mild, temporary keratoconjunctivitis sicca (sometimes referred to as blood-shot eyes, dry eyes or red eye(UK))
    * Varying amounts of paranoia and anxiety in some users

I don't see how you can "Control" syptoms. As for the getting drunk analogy. Being drunk just makes you do stupid stuff and if you're in a and enviroment you might kill someone you really hate. With Marijuana you lose the ability to think, at all. Maybe not with everyone but with the majority that's how it is. And being drunk, you're normally in two places:
1) At home, and if you try to make it to the door you colapse
2) At a bar, in which there are designated drivers who just take you home, and chacnes are you'll pass out soon after anyway.
Marijuana has a lot more fatal effects on people then achool does.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mune'R0x on 2006-04-15 at 23:38:56
QUOTE
And being drunk, you're normally in two places:
1) At home, and if you try to make it to the door you colapse
2) At a bar, in which there are designated drivers who just take you home, and chacnes are you'll pass out soon after anyway.


Well, when you're high you're normally in two places:
1) At home, cause you can get high at home.
2) In a car, when you're dope cruising with some buddies.

And if you're high and are driving or whatever and get pulled over it would be like a DUI? I don't know, I'm messed up.
[/NOTRIGHT]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by SiLeNT(U) on 2006-04-15 at 23:55:23
I said this in the other 4/20 topic and I'll say it here, marijuana won't kill you or cause any diseases. It's nearly harmless other than the fact that it causes memory loss in the long-term but thats not even guaranteed.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Syphon on 2006-04-15 at 23:57:53
QUOTE(TheDaddy0420 @ Apr 15 2006, 06:54 PM)
Kellimus, in America there are more stupid students/kids then you.  Not all will have the will power you have.  It may not be a gateway drug to you, but to them it is.
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If they don't have the willpower of a bipolar person then they should get checked out, they have bigger problems than the wacky tobaccy.

FYI, I'm for legislation of everything and against legislation being necessary.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mune'R0x on 2006-04-16 at 00:02:28
I guess how I really feel about it is that I don't care if they don't legalize it, since I'm gonna get high anyways. It's working out alright for me right now. But if they do legalize it, I'll for sure be a smoker.[/NOTRIGHT]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-04-16 at 04:10:38
QUOTE(Golden-Fist)
With Marijuana you lose the ability to think, at all. Maybe not with everyone but with the majority that's how it is


Only with certain people. I know someone who helped my school win Nationals at AcaDeca (Academic Decathalon) and he is a big big big pot-head. Hell. I've smoked pot for four years, and I'm in college.

Just because there are some people that break down on pot, doesn't mean it's bad.

With that logic, everyone who has an accident, is stupid.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Demaris on 2006-04-16 at 04:19:30
QUOTE(Golden-Fist @ Apr 15 2006, 10:34 PM)
You do know the drug is still illegal right?
I read the Wikipedia on Marijuana and I found a nice long list of things that could happen from just a few smokes:

I don't see how you can "Control" syptoms. As for the getting drunk analogy. Being drunk just makes you do stupid stuff and if you're in a and enviroment you might kill someone you really hate. With Marijuana you lose the ability to think, at all. Maybe not with everyone but with the majority that's how it is. And being drunk, you're normally in two places:
1) At home, and if you try to make it to the door you colapse
2) At a bar, in which there are designated drivers who just take you home, and chacnes are you'll pass out soon after anyway.
Marijuana has a lot more fatal effects on people then achool does.
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Those effects really don't seem that bad, as a some of them could be replicated by taking a run in the wind and a lot of them say "for some users". The good seems to definently outweigh the bad there.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by RexyRex on 2006-04-16 at 04:21:12
You could add to your post that killing brain cells doesn't make you less smart, to match. bored.gif
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-04-16 at 04:41:33
Alcohol kills braincells

Marijuanna impairs them.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kupo on 2006-04-16 at 07:09:05
In amsterdamn i beleive marijuana can be smoked anywhere!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by thien on 2006-04-16 at 08:57:31
That is true, Kupo. The only reason it is legalized over there in Amsterdam is because they don't have a strong government to look at all the good and bad things about it being legalized.

The only bad thing about it being legalized in Amsterdam is that you can have more then a 2 dimes on you at once. Unless you have a card that sais you are a "farmer".

QUOTE
Alcohol kills braincells

Marijuanna impairs them.

Not only does Marijuana do that, it also does these things...

* mood lift, euphoria
* laughter
* relaxation, stress reduction
* creative, philosophical or deep thinking : ideas flow more easily
* increased appreciation of music. More aware of, deeper connection to music.
* increased awareness of senses. (eating, drinking, smell)
* change in experience of muscle fatigue. Pleasant body feel. Increase in body/mind connection.
* pain relief (headaches, cramps)
* reduced nausea, increased appetite (used medically for this)
* boring tasks or entertainment can become more interesting or funny
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Golden-Fist on 2006-04-16 at 11:23:00
QUOTE(Kupo @ Apr 16 2006, 06:08 AM)
In amsterdamn i beleive marijuana can be smoked anywhere![right][snapback]466663[/snapback][/right]

It is, I'm going there this summer...

QUOTE(thien @ Apr 16 2006, 07:57 AM)
* mood lift, euphoria
    * laughter
    * relaxation, stress reduction
    * creative, philosophical or deep thinking : ideas flow more easily
    * increased appreciation of music. More aware of, deeper connection to music.
    * increased awareness of senses. (eating, drinking, smell)
    * change in experience of muscle fatigue. Pleasant body feel. Increase in body/mind connection.
    * pain relief (headaches, cramps)
    * reduced nausea, increased appetite (used medically for this)
    * boring tasks or entertainment can become more interesting or funny[right][snapback]466680[/snapback][/right]

Some of these although worded well can actually be bad. Like change in experience of muscle fatigue, meaning you might not realize that your tired as hell but decide to go lift weights because you're so "powerful". Increased awareness is also called "Paranoia" which isn't a good thing if you thinke veryone is trying kill you. And I don't think laughing all the time while telling people to stop following you is going to look good in a police report. If you're VERY relaxed and don't think of anything bad then you might end up punching some guy in the face and not think about what could happen.

As for Kellimus I guess it's just a werid drug that hasn't been fully understood yet by everyone, but as long as there are deaths or crimes due to the drug then it'll be labled as bad.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mune'R0x on 2006-04-16 at 15:35:33
There were far more deaths and crimes involved with prohibition and bootlegging alochol. And what happened? Alcohol was made legal again.[/NOTRIGHT]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by thien on 2006-04-16 at 15:44:09
There hasn't been any reported deaths of the use of Marijuana. Cigarettes and Alcohol cause more deaths then anyother drug used except for Crack Cocaine and Heroine. And yet they won't legalize Marijuana when it's less lethal then all the other drugs.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kyuubi. on 2006-04-16 at 16:00:40
just comes to show you how diverse and complicated the government can become. they rather legalize drugs that are more harmful to their citizens health than helping. medicinal marijuana would help on curing or preventing some certain critical diseases, but government says its illgeal to sell them so i don't get what the government is doing.
i think sometimes, the government rather wants the population to decrease than increasing. they rather get money of the more harmful things than contribute to human health.

the beer and alcohol and cigarettes than the medicinal use of marijuana in my opinion causes more deaths and violence. there are still people that are drinking and driving that gets into car accidents. other than that, drinking too much beer gives you hangovers, go into a coma, and then maybe death from alcohol abuse. the stuff in beer are poisonous to human cells. if i remember correctly, it takes your body 6 hours to detoxify an ounce of beer.
unfortunately, there are more side effects than i said...but that breakdown.
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