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Where did I say that ? You confuse me.

You said it like you were an extremely psychotic person. You believe in God because he helps you in your life.. how so? Since you seem to have ruled out the hearing voices/seeing visions route, that must mean that you take advice from some religious text, having faith that it is in fact the good word of our Lord. If this is true, I challenge you to name at least one thing your religion has given you an answer to, which if you were to actually do, would not have you immediately jailed.

Another thing about the seeing visions/hearing voices topic. It is impossible to argue that what you are expierencing is not real, however that does not mean we are helpless to defend against such a claim. The human mind depends on basic things like gravity and cause and effect to hold true. If you drop a ball, you expect it to fall. No one would argue these claims. Therefore if you are going to believe in this sort of rational Universe, you should also believe that there are other laws which hold true everywhere. One of these laws is that history repeats itself. But this can be taken to an even broader context, nothing happens only once. There is nothing unique. So to claim to be the one unique person who is capable of hearing these voices is egotistical. Claiming to be unique in that you are better than everyone else in any way is egotistical. This is why these people are not believed.

Maybe a bit rude, but not insane indeed.

Yes, he does. I believe that if I do something really wrong, my conscience will punish me for that.

And who are you to make claims like that ? You basically told me to say what WOULD HAVE HAPPENED. Nobody knows what would have happened if he/she did something not like he/she did in reality.

My religion has given me one answer to one big question: "Should I try to be good?" - "Yes, it's worth it".

For my last post, I just want to tell a little story.

Three men are sitting in a room. There is a table and some chairs for them to sit down, and on one end of the room is a door. A small dial next to the door states that the temperature behind the door is one hundred degrees fahrenheit. There is a loudspeaker in the room from which a voice echoes, "Behind the door is an ice cube." The men begin to discuss this strange fact. Soon they argue. The first man's argument is simple: "The person on the loudspeaker just told us there was an icecube in there, and I have no reason not to believe him." The second man's argument is quite the opposite: "Why would you believe what he says? It's clearly impossible for an ice cube to exist in a room whose temperature is over two hundred degrees!" While the two men are arguing, the third man has opened the door, and discovered the answer.

My point is, religious people think crazy stuff, rationalists think logical stuff, but the truly intelligent person just looks at the answer.


You don't need religion for that. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tit_for_tat

By saying that, thedefault way of life must be to do bad. So then, you've answered my question; you will be bad unless god is there. Is it possible to live a good life without a reward? In your case, no (as you've said, it's not worth it).

Given to two quotes, which one is better:
"I live a good life only because I'll go to heaven afterwards."

"I'd rather live a good life and go to hell than live a bad life and go to heaven."

(This is assuming a Christian god, or another deity that follows in a similar fashion)


You qutoed me.

How can you look at the answer, when nobody has found it yet, and nobody ever will ?

Well, a person would first have to be more open minded. Then, go on the discovery journey! You know, the path of enlightenment. Reading wikipedia, watching the Discovery channel, read a book on something cool.

Some peopel need, some don't. You don't, I do.


No. Please tell me the logical chain that led you to this. Bad is not the default - if it would be, why do some sometimes seek to be good ? The Devil doesen't seek to become good, because he is pure evil.

Wrong. Some people live not a bad life, and then decide one day to start believing in God. So, they were bad before God came into their life ?

I didn't mean "worth" it as in "you will get a reward". I mean that being good = keeping yourself "healthy" on the "inside".


If I would live for the afterlife, I would probably spend my life in the church, would not call some people "idiots", would pray much more than I do now, and much much more.

Did you watch the thing on the discovery channel about global warming?

Were you ever in clan Sephiroth? (The top PVP World Of Warcraft Clan)

The 2nd guy was not the logical one, the 3rd guy was. Why sit there and argue about something when you can find out in just 2 sec. If only religion was that easy. You seem pretty smart to have come up with an example like that, but you just forgot that the door is much harder to open in the religious debate.

Jammed, wether you believe in god or not, you have to realise that by believing in God you're supporting a mentality that has murdered MANY people over the years. And you support that mentality just so you can sleep better at night. If that's not ironic, then I don't know what is.

I can't help myself.

Most people on either side of the God question don't really think about why they believe in it. Athiests believe in what they believe because they have been raised from birth on principles like evolution and caring for others. Thiests believe what they believe because they have been raised from birth on principles like how glorious the complex Universe is, that a God must have done it. Also racism and hatred of others. The real problem with religion is that all the major ones condone violence, support intolerance, and other forms of maliciousness. The primary goal of religion is not human happiness, though this has become a small facet of it in the past century. I don't care what you believe, as long as you understand why you believe it. I have come to a point in my life where I feel that the truth really doesn't matter all that much. No human being can be truly happy unless he is, among other things, at ease about the future, and to ever fully satisfy that condition one must at the very least entertain the possibility that there is something beyond the grave.

An elderly man is lying on his deathbed, and his daughter has fallen seriously ill. Unknownst to him, his daughter dies. Do you trouble the old man with this news, or let him die in peace?

I will leave you to decide what the old man represents, what the news of his daughter's death represents, and what this means for you.

That explains the one way ticket to eternal insanity. I'd say thats fair enough for hard core religious people. God threads aren't serious. Seriously, I dont know why Lite Discussion is there when this is here =/

Natural Terraformation : Billions of years, not Thousands of years.
Artificial Terraformation : Impossible with our current technology, ineffective when it will be a thousand years, 5 years maximum. Terraformation can be done by drawing some ice asteroids plunging into Mars then using some heating machine and gas it up.
Venus might be a valuable source of gas, using them for resource for weapons and fuel. Mercury is filled with Ferrous material, very valuable indeed.

I think we should go outer-space after the Earth is unified by one country.

I don't think a belief in God is harmful. I think organized religion is, however.

Organized religions are managed by deceivers and liars, and they give down "religious" commandments for the sake of personal profit. In many ways, organized religion is really just a company like Walmart, they gather huge amounts of money and political clout, then use it to support their agenda. It's all about exploition, it's all about money and power.

A belief in a God, by itself, is alright, but belief that you need someone else to lead you to him isn't. People, when they find they have the blind support of other people, will use it for their own profit.

tru.dat. Ever wonder where offering goes to?

Lol, nah. But that'd be kickass though ;P

Have you ever gotten a boner just by looking at a picture of a girl? Fully clothed, I mean, not pr0n.

Ok. You said:

You picked yes with the reason "it's worth it." From here, we come to a split. If you say "worth it", as in salvation, then you are being good in fear of being sent to hell. If you say because from a religious point of view, it's the better thing to do, then we can come with the conclusion that you believe it is impossible to be good without religious values.*I don't see any other possibilities (and these are the only two I've come across all my life) so you can choose either one.

Obviously, had you said "No, it's not worth it.", then the default life would be bad. If you're not good, then you're bad. Neutral cannot exist as you've already taken a side; besides, if you were neutral, you would have no emotions which I doubt is true.

Your choice was obviously "Yes" and the second version. I should probably explain that version a lot bit more thorough as it's somewhat confusing. But, before I do, I need to know where you think morals come from. My conclusion above can only be reached if you believe it comes from religion; of course, if you say it doesn't come from religion, then you contradicted yourself in saying god is necessary.


This:

is what you chose? If so, that is pathetic. The second quote describes me perfectly. Why? Because if I know I lived a good life, one where I helped people, then I have fulfilled my place in society. I've contributed something. What happens after death, I won't care. If god does exist (with heaven), doesn't it seem more logical that god would judge on good works rather than faith? Of course, Desperado's idea of an evil is god is just as possible.

bleh i believe in god kinda but i dont believe he actually helps us and to be honoust why should i.

1) the whole fact you cant hear, see, touch, taste, or smell him
2) the whole chineese whispers thing where the bible coulda started out a story and then bam moved on to be a religion
3)you never know jesus could of been a harry potter book back in the day
4)there is so many religions and they all have different views on how god helped them but claim god is completely different in some views showing that it could possibly be just made up stuff
5)i hate islam's beliefs for the soul reason it makes no sense. they say that god wrote the qur'an so there religion is the right path. they say that the qur'an told them stuff before it happened yet the qur'an also has flying unicorn hippagriff things. the whole you should convert to islam or ull go to hell thing is a little overboard. the fact that if u change from isalm to another religion like christianity the penalty is death ( cmon man a little harsh dont you think if god wanted them dead hed of killed them himself )

so yeah i do believe god MAY be real but i dont think we have to live by a book or pray to him in order to "seek his guidance" or his help or wateva and yeah somebody will show me up or w.e or complain i have bad grammar but bleh i know i do and i cant really help that and ermm yeah this is all just my opinion

Wrong.

The person below me is a Zoroastrian priest.

Damn right I am.

The person below me is a Rastafarian Bongalistic.

No..

the person below me is indeed a christian

Technically, but I don't really go to church anymore.

The person below me wants to be the Antichrist.