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Staredit Network -> Serious Discussion -> Iran on the edge
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-07 at 23:58:57
QUOTE(Stalingrad @ May 7 2006, 08:24 PM)
We weren't talking about Iraq, we were talking about the rights we have in America and if they've been violated.
This is filled with half-truths. You feel that the government is constantly monitoring your everymove when they are incapable in doing that. The most they could ever effectivley check is a couple ten thousand at best. Their lists to profile people are very slim and I actually could care less if I'm on it. Only paranoid people like you probably give a damn anyways.

Not every international call gets tapped either, that's just an insane thought.
What rights have the government actually broken that effect YOU, YOU in anyway? In what ways does it affect your everyday life? Or are you just naturally jumpy to any thought of people listening in or watching.

Also, the government should have access to library records. They have caught criminals in the past and I'm pretty sure they are government funded (or can be traced to a federal fund) because they are a public facility and don't make an income.
Nice generalization.
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Camo just rebuttled your first comment. Onto the next

Incapable of doing it hu? You put to much trust in the government. Did you know they supplied our troops in Vietnam with drugs? Don't call me a conspiracy theorist on that one, I know two Vietnam Veterans. And what makes you so sure? Don't you know anything about programming? Do you know how easy and simple it is to type some code up that makes it so if you check a book out that is on their "wanted list", that it directly sends your information to whatever agency is watching over the PRIVATE records? If being paranoid is bad, then what is not caring that your freedoms are being sucked away from you?

That is stupidity.

You really need to learn some Abstract Thinking.

And so now you are calling me insaine, because my government TOLD ME that EVERY INTERNATIONAL CALL, is tapped? Again, ignorance.

Privacy. That effects EVERYONE whether your ignorant ego want's to believe it or not. If I allow my government to intrude on someone, that means I give them the right to intrude on myself. I have a brain, and do not like the government poking into my PRIVATE life. To bad you're to damn ignorant and uncaring to realize the great and potentual harm The Patriot Act has and will cause.

The government should have access to my personal things eh? Sorry to burst your bubble, but the GOVERNMENT hasn't caught criminals like that. Law Enforcement has. Two entirelly different entities.

Sorry to burst your bubble yet again, but Libraries are STATE FUNDED. Not FEDERAL.


And how is speaking the TRUTH, generalizing? Just because you have no rebuttle against it? How immature.

You really need to grow up before you rebuttle anymore. Your logic is that of a pre-teen, and it's getting rather redundant and dull, having to explain over and over and over to a little kid.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2006-05-08 at 15:03:42
I, as a Muslim, can say that Kellimus did not generalize when he said muslims do not believe in income tax. Half of the reason the Muslim religion was founded was due to extortionate, CAPITALIST businessmen who forced upon their poor clients a massive interest rate.

Thus the reason Muslims do not like credit cards and capitalism and income tax (because income tax takes away from hard-earned money). So, Kellimus was entirely right when he said Muslims don't want income taxes or want a capitalist system.

And, Stalingrad, the rule-breaking of the government HAS affected ME personally. My Governor tried putting surveillance cameras in my mosque. I wish to pray without the prying eyes of suspicious, paranoid people looking at me. Do you formally pray in public, where people set their eyes upon you? I don't and I wouldn't wish to.

Additionally, there is obvious bias against Muslims in America. Remmember the Dubai ports deal? We didn't let Dubai get that port. Yet, we let Venezuela and that psycho leftist, Chavez, have a port. We let China own ports. Why not Dubai? That's a country filled with many Muslims.


Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-05-08 at 18:30:49
QUOTE(NuclearRabbit @ May 6 2006, 08:35 PM)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_army
keyword there is temporary which in essense is the definition for militia. The differance being that these men were better trained. In all actuality the "army" was trained militia. It was disbanded afterwards and years later reformed.
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Based on what I have read from your links above the Continental Army was exactly what its name said, an army.

The continental congress paid for it, appointed leaders of it, those leaders trained it. The Continental Army was a trained army, not a militia. I also don't see anywhere in the text that a militia is temporary.

We have militias right now, I don't see the point in them besides a couple dudes wanting to play army.

QUOTE
You're a freaking hypocrite. Just like Chris.

Example?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-08 at 18:33:41
And why do you come and post only against Euro, after the discussion has moved on? Have to try to have the last words eh?

Anyways: Thank you Ling, for pointing out that most of what I speak are not half-truths.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-05-08 at 18:37:59
QUOTE(Snake)Ling @ May 8 2006, 11:03 AM)
I, as a Muslim, can say that Kellimus did not generalize when he said muslims do not believe in income tax. Half of the reason the Muslim religion was founded was due to extortionate, CAPITALIST businessmen who forced upon their poor clients a massive interest rate.

Thus the reason Muslims do not like credit cards and capitalism and income tax (because income tax takes away from hard-earned money). So, Kellimus was entirely right when he said Muslims don't want income taxes or want a capitalist system.

And, Stalingrad, the rule-breaking of the government HAS affected ME personally. My Governor tried putting surveillance cameras in my mosque. I wish to pray without the prying eyes of suspicious, paranoid people looking at me. Do you formally pray in public, where people set their eyes upon you? I don't and I wouldn't wish to.

Additionally, there is obvious bias against Muslims in America. Remmember the Dubai ports deal? We didn't let Dubai get that port. Yet, we let Venezuela and that psycho leftist, Chavez, have a port. We let China own ports. Why not Dubai? That's a country filled with many Muslims.
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If some of your religious community would stop putting holy wars onto America and Israel then maybe we would be a lot more willings to give you ports.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-08 at 18:44:46
I'm the one that generalizes? That is one of the most prejudice remarks if I have ever heard one.

Isn't it Israel that is against the Muslims in the first place?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-05-08 at 18:47:55
QUOTE(Me)
If some of your religious community would stop putting holy wars onto America and Israel then maybe we would be a lot more willings to give you ports.

Read carefully I was high lighting a selective few.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-08 at 18:53:56
Ah, but you still generalized.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2006-05-08 at 20:53:44
QUOTE(TheDaddy0420 @ May 8 2006, 05:37 PM)
If some of your religious community would stop putting holy wars onto America and Israel then maybe we would be a lot more willings to give you ports.
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If some of your religious community would stop invading muslim countries and calling them a "Freedom Crusade", we'd be a lot more likely to accept some of your ideas about democracy. After all, there ARE Christian terrorists and you dont see Muslims declaring war on Christian countries and invading them. Not all muslims are fooles. YOU, my friend, are prejudiced. You and people who say things such as that are why Muslims dislikes of Westernism increase daily.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-08 at 20:58:10
He's Republican/Conservative.

What do you expect?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-05-08 at 22:38:23
QUOTE(Snake)Ling @ May 8 2006, 04:53 PM)
If some of your religious community would stop invading muslim countries and calling them a "Freedom Crusade", we'd be a lot more likely to accept some of your ideas about democracy. After all, there ARE Christian terrorists and you dont see Muslims declaring war on Christian countries and invading them. Not all muslims are fooles. YOU, my friend, are prejudiced. You and people who say things such as that are why Muslims dislikes of Westernism increase daily.
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I do see them (as in radical islamic terrorists bent on killing civilians) invading and infultrating our cities and countries with the ideas of destruction on their mind.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2006-05-09 at 07:01:11
Oh, so because pockets of my religious community are extremist, you have the right to invade an entire country with ideas of destruction on your minds?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Stalingrad on 2006-05-09 at 15:38:33
QUOTE
If you still don't get the message, please go back to kindergarten, take your ritalin, and listen.


If you can actually relate that to how the US government is "ensalving" its people and not just saying "you're retarded, you can't see what I can", then you have a case.

QUOTE
You really need to grow up before you rebuttle anymore. Your logic is that of a pre-teen, and it's getting rather redundant and dull, having to explain over and over and over to a little kid.


I'd respond to the whole thing but this is just pretty much a repeat of everything we have already said before. "Your logic is flawed, blah blah, you're stupid for not seeing eye to eye with me". I will admit that there are injustices going on in the US government but not on the level you are still saying like I have said a million times.

QUOTE
And, Stalingrad, the rule-breaking of the government HAS affected ME personally. My Governor tried putting surveillance cameras in my mosque. I wish to pray without the prying eyes of suspicious, paranoid people looking at me. Do you formally pray in public, where people set their eyes upon you? I don't and I wouldn't wish to.


Your governor's retarded lol. Sorry to hear that but since religion/state are not intertwined, I don't think those cameras will ever be installed. But if they are, then we have a problem and I will join Kellimus and rant about even the smallest things that are going wrong in this world that conerns America even if I do spout blasphemy. Seriously, no joke. There's stepping the line in my books.

QUOTE
Additionally, there is obvious bias against Muslims in America. Remmember the Dubai ports deal? We didn't let Dubai get that port. Yet, we let Venezuela and that psycho leftist, Chavez, have a port. We let China own ports. Why not Dubai? That's a country filled with many Muslims.


I wouldn't say it concerns religion, but with the people itself. America probably has its reasons probably concerning securities.

QUOTE
I'm the one that generalizes? That is one of the most prejudice remarks if I have ever heard one.

Isn't it Israel that is against the Muslims in the first place?


Let's see, if a bunch of group of Muslims started attacking you just because you wanted to exsist over and over and over again, wouldn't you create atleast a small prejudice against them? Israel would be a peaceful nation now but the Palestinian muslim exremists just won't put down their guns and stop killing Jews in the name of Allah who belong to Israel.

QUOTE
If some of your religious community would stop invading muslim countries and calling them a "Freedom Crusade", we'd be a lot more likely to accept some of your ideas about democracy.


Our religious communities are not declaring war on muslim nations and we are not calling this a "Freedom Crusade". A crusade is the last thing I'd want to happen. The last crusades I remember did not turn out well for either side. sad.gif

I'm sorry but I doubt most Middle Eastern countries would would accept democracy if they haven't already. People who follow the Koran like "hardcore", don't believe in democracy for the most part. Just like Christians that read the bible in Medieval times did not believe in democracy. Different time periods, the same thing happening all over again.

QUOTE
After all, there ARE Christian terrorists and you dont see Muslims declaring war on Christian countries and invading them. Not all muslims are fooles.


We are not declaring a war on Islam like I said, we along with other countries in the Middle East are erradicating the people/ideas that promote the death of others because of their "impurity".
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-05-09 at 19:06:23
QUOTE(Snake)Ling @ May 9 2006, 03:00 AM)
Oh, so because pockets of my religious community are extremist, you have the right to invade an entire country with ideas of destruction on your minds?
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With the ideas of regime change on our minds, yes. Stop crying about this, they pissed us off and now they are getting spanked.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-09 at 19:50:27
QUOTE(Stalingrad @ May 9 2006, 12:38 PM)
We are not declaring a war on Islam like I said, we along with other countries in the Middle East are erradicating the people/ideas that promote the death of others because of their "impurity".
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If I wasn't mistakened, isn't this a "crusade" that we are on? Your precious Dubya even called it that.

QUOTE(Chris)
With the ideas of regime change on our minds, yes. Stop crying about this, they pissed us off and now they are getting spanked.


You need to quit posting here with your bigotry.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mr.Camo on 2006-05-09 at 20:27:43
QUOTE(TheDaddy0420 @ May 8 2006, 02:37 PM)
If some of your religious community would stop putting holy wars onto America and Israel then maybe we would be a lot more willings to give you ports.
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Wow man, wow.
Most of the religious community that the Muslims have is very peaceful to America, it's just the certain few that make it harder for them to be accepted.

That is a very ignorant post of yours, and offends more than enough people here, I'm sure.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Stalingrad on 2006-05-09 at 21:35:59
QUOTE
If I wasn't mistakened, isn't this a "crusade" that we are on? Your precious Dubya even called it that.


Yes, but in the context of a strong struggle ahead. Just like roosevelt told the D-Day troops before they dropped in the towns or landed on the beaches of normandy.

"You are about to embark upon the Great Crusade, toward which we have striven these many months. The eyes of the world are upon you. The hopes and prayers of liberty-loving people everywhere march with you"

Not a religious war.

"my dubya" ? I want that fool out of power, but some of the things he has done I agree with. But ya have to admit, the bad he's caused outweighs the good.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-05-09 at 22:03:37
QUOTE(Mr.Camo @ May 9 2006, 04:27 PM)
Wow man, wow.
Most of the religious community that the Muslims have is very peaceful to America, it's just the certain few that make it harder for them to be accepted.

That is a very ignorant post of yours, and offends more than enough people here, I'm sure.
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Am I wrong? Nope. The few in the muslem community that have pissed us off have done away with all the rest. And it seems for the majority in the muslem community are not doing enough.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-10 at 05:04:21
Why are you generalizing? Pissed us off? Who is us? America? Ha! That's why most of America hates bush. Because we are pissed at Muslims.. That's the most flawed logic if I've ever heard comming from you Chris.

I know nothing about Muslims except MOST are peaceful. So that answers the reason that the majority of Muslims aren't doing anything. They don't want to get into the redundance.

But.. You seem to think that all Muslims support the bad guys (Or so you present yourself), so again I ask you why you generalize.

I'm not pissed at Muslims. Why do you generalize and say I am?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2006-05-10 at 07:00:36
TheDaddy0420: You say we do not do enough to stop the terrorist muslims who follow flawed sects, yet Jesus taught that Christians must not at all kill or maim or shed blood, even in the name of Christianity or God. You blame us for "not doing enough" to stop terrorists. Yet, you, an obvious Christian, probably evangelical, openly support your Christian president in unjust wars against innocent peoples unconnected to the terrorists. This completely goes against your precious Jesus's teachings.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kellodood on 2006-05-10 at 13:48:29
No matter what you say to him, he won't admit defeat Snake. You just proved your point, yet he will come back with SOME form of rebuttle, even after he has clearly been "Pizzownt".. *Sighs*
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2006-05-10 at 15:01:05
What pisses me off even more is that he doesn't even bother spelling the noun for the followers of my religion correctly. They aren't "muslems" goddammit. In fact, if you say it "muslem", it means something akin to evil in Arabic. "Muslem" is offensive, because it shows he doesn't give a crap about Muslims. The word is pronouned "Moo-slim". Not "Muhs-lim".

So, there you have it. He doesn't bother spelling the name of a religious followers correctly, he generalizes, and he puts the blame on the group-entire.

I mean, seriously. Let's take his argument and put it from the viewpoint of the other side:

"Christians are people whose religion preaches the destruction of Muslims and Muslim countries. That's why they invaded Iraq, you know. They vote for evangelical Christian presidents in the west, and many people support these presidents that want to kill us. The majority of the people who don't believe in these presidents simply don't do anything to stop their presidents because Western countries are run by fascist-capitalist presidents."

Don't believe that argument? Neither do I. So why should anyone believe Chris's argument?

Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kashmir on 2006-05-13 at 13:30:38
Watch... Chris will call this "justice in action"
http://www.wimp.com/iraqis/
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2006-05-13 at 22:55:24
QUOTE(Kellimus @ May 10 2006, 01:03 AM)
Why are you generalizing?  Pissed us off?  Who is us?  America?  Ha!  That's why most of America hates bush.  Because we are pissed at Muslims..  That's the most flawed logic if I've ever heard comming from you Chris.

I know nothing about Muslims except MOST are peaceful.  So that answers the reason that the majority of Muslims aren't doing anything.  They don't want to get into the redundance.

But..  You seem to think that all Muslims support the bad guys (Or so you present yourself), so again I ask you why you generalize.

I'm not pissed at Muslims.  Why do you generalize and say I am?
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Side note: Thanks for creating logic FOR me, I didn't know I was following that logic that you see. Hey look I can fly.

I never said you were pissed at muslems, Kellimus you have to be an American for that silly.? lol
If most Americans hate Bush he would not have been relected and/or he would have been impeached. When did I say all muslems support the bad guys? Did I not state TWICE there is a select few.

I generalize becuase I can, I generalize becuase many countries in Africa and the Middle East just don't get it. They don't understand about women's rights etc. They don't understand about a lot of things.

QUOTE(Snake)Ling @ May 10 2006, 03:00 AM)
TheDaddy0420: You say we do not do enough to stop the terrorist muslims who follow flawed sects, yet Jesus taught that Christians must not at all kill or maim or shed blood, even in the name of Christianity or God. You blame us for "not doing enough" to stop terrorists. Yet, you, an obvious Christian, probably evangelical, openly support your Christian president in unjust wars against innocent peoples unconnected to the terrorists. This completely goes against your precious Jesus's teachings.
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Muslems, Muslems, Muslems, Muslems.

I am Catholic, I am forgivin for almost any sins I commit only if I go to confession. When, at least Catholics, kill while in battle in Iraq, we kill for protection for the families at home.

"Christian President"..? haha typical you probably think this is a religious crusade.

Lol, Euro I just posted that same video in another thread. Those are British soldiers, not American haha.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kashmir on 2006-05-14 at 02:29:04
Actually I believe he lost the popular vote, meaning most hate him. Also his polls are at 34% so being that 66% are against him... i'm sure that constitutes the majority. Most of the world hates him and believes he's failed as a president. I can personally say austria, southern Germany, and switzerland hate him.

QUOTE
Lol, Euro I just posted that same video in another thread. Those are British soldiers, not American haha.

No crap fool. I never said they were american. But they are a major ally in the "coalition" in this War on Freedom.. er... "Terror!"
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