Staredit Network

Not 5 days after the release of this program and there is already a protection method against it.

Damn that has to be funny the way Our community works, someone finds something new or makes something new and inmediately people start to work to exploit it and go around them.

Kinda reminds me of a race for first Map hack for v1.12, the first Map hack for v1.12 came out around 12 hours after release of the new patch, for v1.12b it came out 4 hours after it.

Where do you propose the best place is to make a poll about the trigger viewer and a protection integrated with uBeR@TiOn against it?

Both sides have very convincing arguments...

Because then MindArchon goes right around it again.

My god, so what if people can see triggers? Omg they found the password omg! Really people will figure it out anyways, and it doesn't matter even if they won't. If people want to cheat let them, they are playing the map. That is why when there are passwords in most places WE choose our own and set it as the password, and not have one constant password for a saved thing.

A map is just triggers and terrain, terrain you see in the map, triggers are conditions and actions, put together. Who cares if people know how? You can take the time to "protect it" but theres nothing wrong with an trigger viewer to view it anyways.

Well he could just open the map and find out for himself anyway... I just feel like receiving PMs.

DK is greedy for PMs .
Both sides do not have convincing arguments. Don't include anti trigger viewing in the next verson of uBeR@TiOn. The only person still holding his ground is Red2Blue.

I repeat: It is not only possible, but easy to protect your "secret codes" in maps where the triggers can be viewed"

The best argument for anti trigger viewing in uBeR@TiOn, is that a programmer would probably make a new version of the trigger viewer with a save option. Legacy weapon says he could have put it in, but he decided to leave it out on purpose. Well, it wouldn't be too hard to make a clone, and the save option wouldn't be too hard to include.

i never thought of looking at the triggers to find the password. now im going to download your map and find the passwords and ruin my fun! muwahahaha im evil

but anyways, seems nice and be sure to include the location viewer!

Ahh, ive been waiting for someone to do that to me.

Trigger Viewer 1.07 updated to get by this protection.

Anyway, here is a small preview of the location viewer. Clicking on a location on the list will show ONLY that location. I left out the terrain to not make it TOO unfair, and the fact I don't know how to do it

http://shadowfortress.net/screenshot1.jpg

Map passwords = not a big deal compared to the learning that can be done from this. If they want to take the fun out of finding the password themself, thats fine. Its the same thing as playing that same map and using power overwhelming to finish the entire thing.

By the way, taking ownership of triggers is taking this map protection thing to the edge. Unfortanately for you, Staredit Network is a site where we share map making information, including triggers and all that. I am apposed to extracting triggers and using the same ones in a map, but if someone finds a good technique that a map maker used, uses it in their own map, then the programs purpose is forfilled. You should be honored to have someone mimic your style - it means they're impressed with your work and strive to be like you. Theres a reason why our assistance forum has 2,500 topics for help requests, not because we like hording all the map making help for the experts, because we want newbies to make maps, so that we can have as much fun playing theirs as they play our own.

For that screenshot...
Make the square a dimension of 128 times x.
Whenever you hit the number that you think makes a nice size, space the locations out that many pixels (that = x).

See what I mean?

I dont follow you, but the minimap picture is already two times the size it should be.

So it's 256x256?
For every matrix square that's a location, space the location in the program out two pixels. Becuase 256 is twice 128.
Actually, you could do it based on the map size...

OMG YOSHI! HOW COULD YOU BETRAY PROEDIT AND ALLOW SUCH A STEALING PROGRAM ON YOUR SITE!!1oneo1!!!???


sorry yoshi

thank you, im glad this came oout, now people wont be able to go "omg i watn the unprotector to see the triggers thats all omg"

thanks for the program!

I have already given up my ground a little while ago. I figure its best to just shuddup and let things happen.

Who knows how many program updates/changes will result between MindArchon making more versions and DeathKnight finding more ways to foil the trigger viewer .

Oh noz, a war is started.
Run! To the bunkers men! It's the only way we have a chance to survive to make our time.

The size of the "map picture" it two times what it should be. So if you opened a map that was 64x64 you would see an image with all the locations on it that is 128x128.

a 256x256 map would be 512x512.

So yeah, for every matrix that is a location make it two pixels in the program.
See how it works?
*RexyRex is beginning to feel stupid...

Im confused. What am I supposed to do and why am I doing this??

Great program MindArchon, useful in many aspects, but i also am opposed to it in just as many ways.


It's not just about the "hidden" passwords the maps have which are in danger, it's the privacy issue. Yes it doesnt open or edit the map but it still violates the map's privacy rights. But not just the map's privacy, but the author's privacy as well.

Map protecting isn't just about preventing people from stealing or editing maps without the maker's authorization; it's also about privacy issues. Some map makers, especially those with unique styles, would not like random people to just "open" up their map and just look at their triggers. And even though you can't really steal these maps, people could indirectly steal them. The way the program displays the triggers are very similar to those of Starforge; people could just copy them. If you made absolutely brilliant triggers, you wouldn't want them stolen from you would you?

I seriously think this is betraying the community in many ways (but overall not intentionally). Even though it does not enable one to edit the map, you are still able to see the triggers, which are basically the fundamental structures of all UMS maps. That's just as bad as though you were stealing a map. It violates a the maker and his map's privacy; that's one big reason why maps are protected. Some people just would not want people to just see their triggers at all! If you made a really complex map with tons of innovative triggerings which have never been done before and is almost seemingly impossible to do, you wouldn't want some guy you dont know to see how u did the triggers, then copy it, put it on his map, and not give you ANY credit would you?

As i said earlier, this sort of thing is almost as bad as if someone steals your map. The thing about this program is that it allows people to look at and see how your triggers are done without the authors permission. Many of us, like red2blue and others, simply do not want this sort of thing to happen and it really puts us down in this way.


but on the other hand, i also do see many useful things about this program.

Meh, have u seen his picture? I'm sure u'll fall in love with him
[attachmentid=8629]

EDIT: Crap this is the small picture of him. i dont have the big one

Privacy, that's funny.

Look, if these were ACTUAL games or programs I would understand why you people would be getting upset. BUT THEY'RE NOT! They are just minor works that you will forget a couple months after you stop playing SC. Blizzard barely even acknowledges that a Starcraft UMS mapping community exists! They don't even support it! And you're going around worried that people are going to look at your triggers? Oh my god, how selfish and narcissistic can you really get?

If it upgrades to copying and pasting, or past locations and triggers(with the exception of CUWP slots), then it will go too far.

As long as it don't include pasting locations/triggers/sounds I will be okay with it but I still wont use it

You know, anyone can still mimic your map by just playing it and triggering it. Theres no reason "privacy" should be an issue unless you hide your credit card numbers inside triggers.

Nobody wants to copy your map if its as hard as this. If they want to learn from it, this is the tool to use. Its a friggin map for crying outloud. I can understand why people want protection against map stealers pressing a button that says [ UNPROTECT ] then replacing your name with theirs, but protecting against VIEWAGE of a map is totally different. 90% of sc'ers don't do map making, another 5% likely don't have what it takes to copy your map, and the rest may not even care about your map, let alone try to mimic your triggers.

Chill pills for everyone! FREE*

*Is not free. Costs 10 billion dollars.

Privacy should not be an issue. The only real issue is if there are things in your triggers that you don't want people to see because it will ruin gameplay somehow, such as secret locations or a password system. This issue is effectively resolved however.. because...

I opened up that Protected.scx map that Deathknight- made, and upon seeing how he did the protection to block MindArchin's trigger viewer, I burst out laughing. On another note, Deathknight is foolish because he still uses StarForge, which made the map horribly, horribly corrupted.

Red2Blue you said something vile to me on SEN. I don't think it was a spoof.
[EDIT] I spent two hours searching for your post. I think I found it but you deleted the part that was vile.

I'm not sure which is funnier, that Rexy will realize who I am or that the picture is so startling.