Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mini Moose 2707 on 2006-09-05 at 22:58:14
If we honestly can believe that SEN will use map unprotection responsibly... then it follows that we should be able to believe that they can post responsibly. (besides, this might rile me up into a warning/suspending/banning mood and I'll need some targets. 
)
)Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 22:58:36
QUOTE(PCFredZ @ Sep 5 2006, 09:55 PM)
Ooh, forgot to show some surprise.
WOW, Legacy! Didn't expect YOU to be the creator of OSMAP! After every Uberation gave my maps "Too many corridors" error I didn't think you could make any working program at all!
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WOW, Legacy! Didn't expect YOU to be the creator of OSMAP! After every Uberation gave my maps "Too many corridors" error I didn't think you could make any working program at all!
[right][snapback]556294[/snapback][/right]
How DARE you mock the architect of the mighty Uberation, which cannot be penetrated by the sharpest adamantium spear? REPENT, non-believer!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by O)FaRTy1billion on 2006-09-05 at 23:00:51
Eh, talking on MSN about this and thought I should post this too.
QUOTE(Me)
I usually protect my maps to keep the little kidiots without a brain out.. other than that I don't really care. I learned mapping from looking at things.. and to be honest I have unprotected maps to look at how they did something.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Lyon on 2006-09-05 at 23:01:53
Damn, YOU made osmap?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TERRAINFIGHTER on 2006-09-05 at 23:01:58
QUOTE(Mini Moose 2707 @ Sep 5 2006, 09:57 PM)
If we honestly can believe that SEN will use map unprotection responsibly... then it follows that we should be able to believe that they can post responsibly. (besides, this might rile me up into a warning/suspending/banning mood and I'll need some targets. )
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1. I never said they'd use it responsibly...what I meant is you could support the program, but not the maps edited with it.
2. Never, and I repeat NEVER expect SEN members to post responsibly in news posts.
3. That's one of the things I'm afraid of, it will be like war of the planets!
I still think this should be locked up, you're just feeding gasoline to the fire.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DarckRedd on 2006-09-05 at 23:02:56
[SIZE=1]
Fair enough on the first part. However, it's easy to protect your name by hiding it everywhere with various spellings and color combinations.
How's it wrong to want credit for your map?
Fair enough.
Not particularly. My style is my own, as is Moose's.
I don't want to share. There are plenty of tutorials for anyone who takes the time to read them. If they don't even consider trying Google, they certainly aren't intelligent enough to make a unique map.
Overall, I think that unprotection does more harm than good. While I won't deny that it has potential to improve things, I fear the consequences in terms of map theft and rigging more.
Edited to fix a rather glaring typo.
QUOTE(Yoshi da Sniper @ Sep 5 2006, 08:36 PM)
First of all, for making new versions, its going to happen, sure, but everybody these days has DSL, so who cares if you redownload. Although people can replace your name with their name, its possible with a hex editor and string search, protection or no protection. So protection doesn't do very good there.
Fair enough on the first part. However, it's easy to protect your name by hiding it everywhere with various spellings and color combinations.
QUOTE(Yoshi da Sniper @ Sep 5 2006, 08:36 PM)
So, why are people protecting their maps? They're protecting it for bragging rights mainly, which is complete abuse of what it was originally intended for and is no longer necessary for. Thats completely wrong.
How's it wrong to want credit for your map?
QUOTE(Yoshi da Sniper @ Sep 5 2006, 08:36 PM)
As for "retaining fame on battle.net", most of them are interested in playing strip some girl or rigged games. Who honestly cares about regular battle.net users.
Fair enough.
QUOTE(Yoshi da Sniper @ Sep 5 2006, 08:36 PM)
The individuals who will use this kind of thing legitimately are the people in the starcraft community. Isn't it so much more fun if you show off your map to your friends on SEN and after the game they check it out and compliment and suggest things on your triggers? Wouldn't it be nice to open one of mooses maps and get a feel for his style and how he does certain things?
Not particularly. My style is my own, as is Moose's.
QUOTE
This is the final step that SEN must take in becoming a selfless community of one whole instead of a disorganized group of map posters. This can make this community stronger and closer together if everyone shares and acts as equals.
I don't want to share. There are plenty of tutorials for anyone who takes the time to read them. If they don't even consider trying Google, they certainly aren't intelligent enough to make a unique map.
Overall, I think that unprotection does more harm than good. While I won't deny that it has potential to improve things, I fear the consequences in terms of map theft and rigging more.
Edited to fix a rather glaring typo.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 23:06:00
QUOTE(Lyon(MC) @ Sep 5 2006, 10:01 PM)
Damn, YOU made osmap?
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Hm.. I think the study of StarCraft Map Protection Theology should be changed a bit. The LegacyWeapon posting in this thread is not the real LegacyWeapon, for the StarCraft Map Protection Theology Scriptures state that the true LegacyWeapon is a mighty lance that can pierce men's hearts and minds.
The REAL LegacyWeapon does not create programs such as OSMAP, which clearly do nothing but piss people off! Believers, the LegacyWeapon you see before you is not the real saviour! He is a Demiurge, an Ialdaboth, a FALSE GOD!
Oh, when will the real LegacyWeapon come to free our souls of his lies?!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kame on 2006-09-05 at 23:07:26
QUOTE(L-inspecteur_Chocolat @ Sep 5 2006, 07:38 PM)
Shut up retard.
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I unfortunately seem to see this as the general trend of this conversation. You are just not as diplomatic, and to be honest, I've come straight out like that before myself.
It seems that no one here is willing to part half-way. OSMAP, even though I will never and have never used it, is an intelligent way to learn something new. You guys may say that its direct copy and paste, but look at music; its the same chords over and over, just with different progressions, contexts, rhythms, meter, instrumentation...I really don't see how you can get sued for using a perfect third; the first interval a music student learns arguably as well as the first notes of the wedding march.
Wow, now isn't that a difference?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by PCFredZ on 2006-09-05 at 23:09:14
QUOTE(exo6yte @ Sep 5 2006, 10:58 PM)
How DARE you mock the architect of the mighty Uberation, which cannot be penetrated by the sharpest adamantium spear? REPENT, non-believer!
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Uberation protects a map so well that it can't even be read by SC.
EDIT: BTW exo, regardless if all these things you're posting are serious or not, they're pretty spammy.
QUOTE(DarckRedd @ Sep 5 2006, 11:02 PM)
[blah blah blah...]
I don't want to share. There are plenty of tutorials for anyone who takes the time to read them. If they don't even consider trying Google, they certainly aren't intelligent enough to make a unique map.
I don't want to share. There are plenty of tutorials for anyone who takes the time to read them. If they don't even consider trying Google, they certainly aren't intelligent enough to make a unique map.
Sharing is caring. Play nice.
QUOTE
Overall, I think that protection does more harm than good. While I won't deny that it has potential to improve things, I fear the consequences in terms of map theft and rigging more.
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I agree with the first sentence because I've lost many a maps to protection too (WoS2 and Majesty)... but I guess you might have meant to say "unprotection".
You can't prevent rigging. There's no prevention for idiocy.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 23:11:16
QUOTE(Kame @ Sep 5 2006, 10:07 PM)
I unfortunately seem to see this as the general trend of this conversation. You are just not as diplomatic, and to be honest, I've come straight out like that before myself.
It seems that no one here is willing to part half-way. OSMAP, even though I will never and have never used it, is an intelligent way to learn something new. You guys may say that its direct copy and paste, but look at music; its the same chords over and over, just with different progressions, contexts, rhythms, meter, instrumentation...I really don't see how you can get sued for using a perfect third; the first interval a music student learns arguably as well as the first notes of the wedding march.
Wow, now isn't that a difference?
[right][snapback]556306[/snapback][/right]
It seems that no one here is willing to part half-way. OSMAP, even though I will never and have never used it, is an intelligent way to learn something new. You guys may say that its direct copy and paste, but look at music; its the same chords over and over, just with different progressions, contexts, rhythms, meter, instrumentation...I really don't see how you can get sued for using a perfect third; the first interval a music student learns arguably as well as the first notes of the wedding march.
Wow, now isn't that a difference?
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Alas, the devil has tricked poor, innocent Kame into spreading the lies of the False LegacyWeapon!
If we have lost Kame, who else can be lost?!
Woe....
Ah, I feel inspired by this sad moment! I think I'll write some stupid, depressing poetry!
QUOTE
The cool, sharp weapon
impales me
the blood, once innocent, drips down slowly
I sob a pool of bloody tears as my betrayer stands over my dying body with a grim and frostbitten knife
and I DIE BECAUSE LEGACYWEAPON BETRAYED US ALL, WOE WOE WOE I AM ANGST INCARNATE
impales me
the blood, once innocent, drips down slowly
I sob a pool of bloody tears as my betrayer stands over my dying body with a grim and frostbitten knife
and I DIE BECAUSE LEGACYWEAPON BETRAYED US ALL, WOE WOE WOE I AM ANGST INCARNATE
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kame on 2006-09-05 at 23:12:10
Tricked? Like hell! There is no devil in me! REPENT, I TELL YOU REPENT!
lol. okay. I can't do this. I can't take it seriously...I-I'm sorry.
To be quite honest, LegacyWeapon is the best damn thin to happen to SeN since the end of Yoshi's leadership.
lol. okay. I can't do this. I can't take it seriously...I-I'm sorry.
To be quite honest, LegacyWeapon is the best damn thin to happen to SeN since the end of Yoshi's leadership.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DarckRedd on 2006-09-05 at 23:12:24
Stop that! It's silly!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by PCFredZ on 2006-09-05 at 23:13:19
QUOTE
The cool, sharp weapon
impales me
the blood, once innocent, drips down slowly
I sob a pool of bloody tears as my betrayer stands over my dying body with a grim and frostbitten knife
and I DIE BECAUSE LEGACYWEAPON BETRAYED US ALL, WOE WOE WOE I AM ANGST INCARNATE
impales me
the blood, once innocent, drips down slowly
I sob a pool of bloody tears as my betrayer stands over my dying body with a grim and frostbitten knife
and I DIE BECAUSE LEGACYWEAPON BETRAYED US ALL, WOE WOE WOE I AM ANGST INCARNATE
Ashes to ashes, dust to dust
Pointless idiocy provokes disgust
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Arbitrary on 2006-09-05 at 23:13:54
Would this be a bad time to tell you all that I have sickle cell?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 23:14:15
QUOTE(Kame @ Sep 5 2006, 10:11 PM)
Tricked? Like hell! There is no devil in me! REPENT, I TELL YOU REPENT!
lol. okay. I can't do this. I can't take it seriously...I-I'm sorry.
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lol. okay. I can't do this. I can't take it seriously...I-I'm sorry.
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Oh, Kame, your words make me bleed like an Impaled Northern Moongoat sobbing as the Northern Necrowizard's Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Evil spell of Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very evil NecroSummoning calls from Necrodemons from the Doomed Necrograte of Fetid Death Demons.
I cry.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Arbitrary on 2006-09-05 at 23:15:11
QUOTE(exo6yte @ Sep 5 2006, 11:13 PM)
Oh, Kame, your words make me bleed like an Impaled Northern Moongoat sobbing as the Northern Necrowizard's Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Evil spell of Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very Very evil NecroSummoning calls from Necrodemons from the Doomed Necrograte of Fetid Death Demons.
I cry.
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I cry.
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Seth Putnam rides again!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kame on 2006-09-05 at 23:16:51
Let me go cast my circle and we can continue this conversation...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 23:17:15
QUOTE(Arbitrary @ Sep 5 2006, 10:14 PM)
Seth Putnam rides again!
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Impaled Northern Moonforest owns.
LegacyWeapon is a Necrowizard.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by SiLeNT(U) on 2006-09-05 at 23:20:26
Wow, this comes as a major shock to me, but OSMAP helped unprotect some of my old maps to see how I used to do things, so in that way it helped me. However, I strongly disagree with what Legacys doing, people should have the choice to leave their maps unprotected or protected. Legacy shouldn't be allowed to decide that for them, it isn't going to bring people back to SC, if anything, it will make frustrated mapmakers leave. If people want to learn how to mapmake, there are plenty of tutorials in SEN and the (U) wiki.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Syphon on 2006-09-05 at 23:22:35
Yes.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 23:22:57
QUOTE(SiLeNT(U) @ Sep 5 2006, 10:20 PM)
Wow, this comes as a major shock to me, but OSMAP helped unprotect some of my old maps to see how I used to do things, so in that way it helped me. However, I strongly disagree with what Legacys doing, people should have the choice to leave their maps unprotected or protected. Legacy shouldn't be allowed to decide that for them, it isn't going to bring people back to SC, if anything, it will make frustrated mapmakers leave. If people want to learn how to mapmake, there are plenty of tutorials in SEN and the (U) wiki.
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Yes, you're right... OSMAP is the way to true power... with OSMAP, you can summon Dark Evil Fetid Necrobatingly Julienning upon the Mountain while Disembowling the Chilly Northern Slope maps with the power of the Frostbitten and Scandinavian Deathgoat.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mr.Kirbycode774 on 2006-09-05 at 23:30:45
*reads about everything*
Okay so let's see... *sorts stuff out in a random order* (gray = my thoughts)
1) According to these posts, Blizzard lacks enthusiasm towards SC and cannot be used for or against protection.
2) LegacyWeapon was the one who released OSMAP four months ago. I'm guessing he wanted to wait for everyone to cool down before telling the truth. Unfortunately, that plan backfired on him. Multiple people see Legacy as either a hypocrite or a traitor.
3) We have tutorials for everything! (except multi-colored marines)
4) Moose is going to post his decision on this matter tomorrow! Yay!
5) I just realized how silly it would be for new mapmakers trying to understand pro mapmaker's maps via osmap. It's like trying to read a secretary's shorthand with little experience of reading it. Heck I couldn't read it if I tried...
6) OSMAP allows you to bypass protection somehow. Anyways, it can be used to help and hinder, as Silent(U) indirectly stated.
7) exo6yte is tangenting the thread with randomness. I can't tell if he's trying to allude to religious stuff because of how poor it is.
Well.. that sums up about everything, besides lots of bickering of course.
Okay so let's see... *sorts stuff out in a random order* (gray = my thoughts)
1) According to these posts, Blizzard lacks enthusiasm towards SC and cannot be used for or against protection.
2) LegacyWeapon was the one who released OSMAP four months ago. I'm guessing he wanted to wait for everyone to cool down before telling the truth. Unfortunately, that plan backfired on him. Multiple people see Legacy as either a hypocrite or a traitor.
3) We have tutorials for everything! (except multi-colored marines)
4) Moose is going to post his decision on this matter tomorrow! Yay!
5) I just realized how silly it would be for new mapmakers trying to understand pro mapmaker's maps via osmap. It's like trying to read a secretary's shorthand with little experience of reading it. Heck I couldn't read it if I tried...
6) OSMAP allows you to bypass protection somehow. Anyways, it can be used to help and hinder, as Silent(U) indirectly stated.
7) exo6yte is tangenting the thread with randomness. I can't tell if he's trying to allude to religious stuff because of how poor it is.
Well.. that sums up about everything, besides lots of bickering of course.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 23:32:25
8: And I'll probably be banned for being an Asian speaking against the White Racist Power Structure of OSMAP.
It was a blast, anyway.
It was a blast, anyway.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by LegacyWeapon on 2006-09-05 at 23:32:56
QUOTE(Mr.Kirbycode774 @ Sep 5 2006, 11:30 PM)
2) LegacyWeapon was the one who released OSMAP four months ago. I'm guessing he wanted to wait for everyone to cool down before telling the truth. Unfortunately, that plan backfired on him. Multiple people see Legacy as either a hypocrite or a traitor.
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Exactly. I knew people wouldn't like it very much if I released it so I wanted people to see a society with it first. But it didn't exactly work.[right][snapback]556327[/snapback][/right]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by SiLeNT(U) on 2006-09-05 at 23:34:33
Yes, it can be used to help and hinder, however I think that people should only be allowed to unprotect their own maps, not other peoples.