Report, edit, etc...Posted by LegacyWeapon on 2006-09-05 at 22:04:01
QUOTE(Mini Moose 2707 @ Sep 5 2006, 10:01 PM)
1. Fire LegacyWeapon. SEN (as of now) does not support unprotection in any way, but obviously having a Global Moderator that's created OSMap who is hosting a database of unprotected maps is a serious problem.
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1. The database contains no unprotected maps. Only statistics.[right][snapback]556193[/snapback][/right]
2. My views do not reflect the views of SEN.
3. You can't do anything about how I released OSMAP. The fact is that I released it.
QUOTE
Map Unprotection
SEN does not support Map Unprotection for any reason, even if it is for your own map. You are allowed to support unprotection and debate the issue of protection, but posting any unprotectors or links to unprotectors is not allowed.
SEN does not support Map Unprotection for any reason, even if it is for your own map. You are allowed to support unprotection and debate the issue of protection, but posting any unprotectors or links to unprotectors is not allowed.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Desperado on 2006-09-05 at 22:05:00
You are delegates of people you have never known, or ever will know.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Cnl.Fatso on 2006-09-05 at 22:05:46
Someone forgot his meds, I see.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CheeZe on 2006-09-05 at 22:06:11
QUOTE(Yoshi da Sniper @ Sep 5 2006, 09:01 PM)
If by "right" you mean "bragging rights" then you are correct.
No. Since when did "right to lock maps" equal "bragging rights"? Just because you think it's the same doesn't make it so. If you want to continue to misinterpret what I say, go ahead; I'm not arguing to change your mind, I'm arguing to reveal how flawed your logic is for other people who are reading this.
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If I make a map with staredit, I can open it with staredit. Thats open source my friend.
I know what open source is. I support open source in programming. This isn't programming; even if it was, I still support a person's right to have their program close sourced.
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Sure you can place units and protect the map. You have the right to, but now people can see your map anyway so theres no point. But you do have the right to.
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That's like having a law that says "you're allowed to drink under 18" and "If you drink under 18, you go to jail". You have the right to drink, but you'll pay for it heavily.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by IsaT on 2006-09-05 at 22:06:50
QUOTE(Desperado @ Sep 5 2006, 09:02 PM)
Everyone's views on this matter are horribly distorted by your limited knowledge of the very things you claim to stand for. The StarEdit network is not map making, it never has been, and it never will be. The real map makers on Battle.net have never been to this website and they likely never will be. Anyone who utilizes this website as a springboard for their map making has never created a map that was played on Battle.net by countless people. You have nothing to worry about when it comes to protection and unprotection. The problem with these programs is that the REAL map makers are now affected by your actions. The members of SEN with malicious take these tools and harm REAL map makers on Battle.net. You give guns to children and then put them into a room filled with intelligent mature human beings and praise their destruction because you neglect to see that the intelligent mature beings ever existed in the first place. You are bloated animals with no regard for what you do, and you tarnish the practices of production. Only a few members among you have ever proved useful for even a moment, if only to unveil some new and amazing technique which is instantly patched by Blizzard. You are utterly useless and your only power is to destroy. You are in a single word, evil. You are chaos innate, destruction, rampant and loose upon the world.
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Wow.. quite the rant..
I never protect my maps, i see no point to it anymore, and i never did in the first place.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Yoshi da Sniper on 2006-09-05 at 22:09:34
QUOTE(Desperado @ Sep 5 2006, 10:02 PM)
Everyone's views on this matter are horribly distorted by your limited knowledge of the very things you claim to stand for. The StarEdit network is not map making, it never has been, and it never will be. The real map makers on Battle.net have never been to this website and they likely never will be. Anyone who utilizes this website as a springboard for their map making has never created a map that was played on Battle.net by countless people. You have nothing to worry about when it comes to protection and unprotection. The problem with these programs is that the REAL map makers are now affected by your actions. The members of SEN with malicious take these tools and harm REAL map makers on Battle.net. You give guns to children and then put them into a room filled with intelligent mature human beings and praise their destruction because you neglect to see that the intelligent mature beings ever existed in the first place. You are bloated animals with no regard for what you do, and you tarnish the practices of production. Only a few members among you have ever proved useful for even a moment, if only to unveil some new and amazing technique which is instantly patched by Blizzard. You are utterly useless and your only power is to destroy. You are in a single word, evil. You are chaos innate, destruction, rampant and loose upon the world.
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You're forgetting who you're talking to when you tell me what this site was created for.[right][snapback]556195[/snapback][/right]
You tell me exactly right now how this harms map makers. Don't tell me "it unprotects maps". Actually TELL me how destructive this program will be to people and how. Then, I'll tell you the positives, and then we'll see which is better.
The problem is, you've all convinced yourself so much that map protectors are wonderful. If someone like me can change and adapt, then so can the rest of you. I used to be the biggest pro-protector guy on the internet. If I changed, (and I never do unless I have a very good reason), dont you think theres more to it then that?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by RexyRex on 2006-09-05 at 22:10:56
QUOTE(The_Shattered_moose @ Sep 5 2006, 06:51 PM)
Yeah, well starcraft didn't come with extended units, most AI scripts, or many other "features" that us mappers now take for granted either.
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Yes it did.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mini Moose 2707 on 2006-09-05 at 22:11:36
QUOTE(LegacyWeapon @ Sep 5 2006, 10:03 PM)
3. You can't do anything about how I released OSMAP. The fact is that I released it.
We can't do anything about that dead body on the floor, but as for the murderer...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Yoshi da Sniper on 2006-09-05 at 22:11:36
QUOTE(CheeZe @ Sep 5 2006, 10:05 PM)
No. Since when did "right to lock maps" equal "bragging rights"? Just because you think it's the same doesn't make it so. If you want to continue to misinterpret what I say, go ahead; I'm not arguing to change your mind, I'm arguing to reveal how flawed your logic is for other people who are reading this.
I know what open source is. I support open source in programming. This isn't programming; even if it was, I still support a person's right to have their program close sourced.
That's like having a law that says "you're allowed to drink under 18" and "If you drink under 18, you go to jail". You have the right to drink, but you'll pay for it heavily.
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I know what open source is. I support open source in programming. This isn't programming; even if it was, I still support a person's right to have their program close sourced.
That's like having a law that says "you're allowed to drink under 18" and "If you drink under 18, you go to jail". You have the right to drink, but you'll pay for it heavily.
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Okay well, I guess people have the right to unprotect maps too then. I don't think my logic is flawed, I think you're just misunderstanding it in hopes of justifying protectors.
How is map making unlike programming? You create something and people most of the time use it.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Lord_Agamemnon(MM) on 2006-09-05 at 22:11:49
QUOTE
Yes it did
Staredit didn't, though. I'm going to go run and hide in a hole now--seems like a sensible option for me at this point...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Chef on 2006-09-05 at 22:13:04
Since it is illegal (not to mention very hard) to make money off of StarCraft maps you've created, the only thing you're losing from forced open source is your right to be a little *****. The StarCraft community doesn't need 10,000 brats more worried about being known for their map than creating a fun map.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mini Moose 2707 on 2006-09-05 at 22:13:57
Are we not supposed to take pride in our work?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by The_Shattered_moose on 2006-09-05 at 22:14:24
QUOTE
Since it is illegal (not to mention very hard) to make money off of StarCraft maps you've created, the only thing you're losing from forced open source is your right to be a little *****. The StarCraft community doesn't need 10,000 brats more worried about being known for their map than creating a fun map.
You're wrong, it needs them if they also make good, playable maps.
You seem to be equating good maps with good people, which is not true at all. A mapper could be the brattiest person in the world, yet still be brilliant.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CheeZe on 2006-09-05 at 22:15:37
QUOTE(Yoshi da Sniper @ Sep 5 2006, 09:11 PM)
Okay well, I guess people have the right to unprotect maps too then. I don't think my logic is flawed, I think you're just misunderstanding it in hopes of justifying protectors.
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I only support rights that do not destroy another right. Your belief in that right destroys a right that was previously in existance. Thus, your belief in that right, under my point of view, is flawed.
The question now is, which one of us seems to be the "lesser of two evils"? Me, a person who supports rights that does not destroy another right, or you, a person who seems to support a right that destroys another right? Let the public decide.
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How is map making unlike programming? You create something and people most of the time use it.
My argue applies regardless. Read:
QUOTE
This isn't programming; even if it was, I still support a person's right to have their program close sourced.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Desperado on 2006-09-05 at 22:15:41
QUOTE
The problem is, you've all convinced yourself so much that map protectors are wonderful. If someone like me can change and adapt, then so can the rest of you. I used to be the biggest pro-protector guy on the internet. If I changed, (and I never do unless I have a very good reason), dont you think theres more to it then that?
I am SaLaCiouS(U). I am Shmidley. I am the one person who knows that you are one of the most evil creatures ever to walk this Earth. Do not question me for one single second, for I know your every secret you despicable piece of trash.
I have never known a human being more capable of deception and wrongdoing. You purposefully lied at every turn to everyone around you. You used (U)Bolt_Head and the entire Clan (U)nKnoWn to your own ends to popularize this website and then you attempted to toss us aside. You attempted to take over Clan (U) yourself, and very much destroyed it. Map making is dead and you are the sole reason.
Do not speak to us on issues which you have no right to speak on. You have never made a map, you have not even played StarCraft in many months. Given the chance I would gleefully end your disgusting life.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by RexyRex on 2006-09-05 at 22:15:45
QUOTE(Lord_Agamemnon @ Sep 5 2006, 07:11 PM)
QUOTE(RexyRex @ Sep 5 2006, 07:10 PM)
QUOTE(The_Shattered_moose @ Sep 5 2006, 06:51 PM)
Yeah, well starcraft didn't come with extended units, most AI scripts, or many other "features" that us mappers now take for granted either.
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Report, edit, etc...Posted by exo6yte on 2006-09-05 at 22:16:35
QUOTE(Yoshi da Sniper @ Sep 5 2006, 08:36 PM)
This is the final step that SEN must take in becoming a selfless community of one whole instead of a disorganized group of map posters. This can make this community stronger and closer together if everyone shares and acts as equals.
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LegacyWeapon betrays the entire community and you support him? Way to go, you're even more out-of-touch with the mapping community here than I am.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by LegacyWeapon on 2006-09-05 at 22:17:18
QUOTE(RexyRex @ Sep 5 2006, 10:15 PM)
Yes, but all those bells and whistles used in SCXE come from the StarCraft game. They were not created by some random programmer, whereas map protection was.
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Map protection is an unnatural process. I'm just working to fix maps and make them how Blizzard intended.[right][snapback]556220[/snapback][/right]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CheeZe on 2006-09-05 at 22:18:47
Show me where Blizzard intended that. I asked this from Yoshi already, no answer. You?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mini Moose 2707 on 2006-09-05 at 22:18:57
Fix? I had no idea maps were broken.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by WoodenFire on 2006-09-05 at 22:19:18
Map Protection should be a requirement of any map...
I should say that, if you want to view the inner workings of a map, ask the map makers. Email them questions, ask them if they can get some test maps of systems in the map...
People, not alone maps, should be the source of learning.
Now that you have made OSMAP, how about a little Anti-OSMAP info? Jerk!
I should say that, if you want to view the inner workings of a map, ask the map makers. Email them questions, ask them if they can get some test maps of systems in the map...
People, not alone maps, should be the source of learning.
Now that you have made OSMAP, how about a little Anti-OSMAP info? Jerk!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Chef on 2006-09-05 at 22:20:40
QUOTE
You're wrong, it needs them if they also make good, playable maps.
You seem to be equating good maps with good people, which is not true at all. A mapper could be the brattiest person in the world, yet still be brilliant.
You seem to be equating good maps with good people, which is not true at all. A mapper could be the brattiest person in the world, yet still be brilliant.
The funnest time I ever had playing Battle.net was back in the early years. Whether it's a coincidence or not, this was before anyone protected their maps.
And no, I'm actually just equatting people who want to protect their maps to brats. That, or they're just going with the flow of what everyone else is doing, suspecting it's safer not to go against it.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by RexyRex on 2006-09-05 at 22:20:50
QUOTE(CheeZe @ Sep 5 2006, 07:18 PM)
Show me where Blizzard intended that. I asked this from Yoshi already, no answer. You?
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Show us where they intended to have protection? [right][snapback]556223[/snapback][/right]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Yoshi da Sniper on 2006-09-05 at 22:21:49
QUOTE(Desperado @ Sep 5 2006, 10:15 PM)
I am SaLaCiouS(U). I am Shmidley. I am the one person who knows that you are one of the most evil creatures ever to walk this Earth. Do not question me for one single second, for I know your every secret you despicable piece of crap.
I have never known a human being more capable of deception and wrongdoing. You purposefully lied at every turn to everyone around you. You used (U)Bolt_Head and the entire Clan (U)nKnoWn to your own ends to popularize this website and then you attempted to toss us aside. You attempted to take over Clan (U) yourself, and very much destroyed it. Map making is dead and you are the sole reason.
Do not speak to us on issues which you have no right to speak on. You have never made a map, you have not even played StarCraft in many months. Given the chance I would gleefully end your disgusting life.
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Okay.I have never known a human being more capable of deception and wrongdoing. You purposefully lied at every turn to everyone around you. You used (U)Bolt_Head and the entire Clan (U)nKnoWn to your own ends to popularize this website and then you attempted to toss us aside. You attempted to take over Clan (U) yourself, and very much destroyed it. Map making is dead and you are the sole reason.
Do not speak to us on issues which you have no right to speak on. You have never made a map, you have not even played StarCraft in many months. Given the chance I would gleefully end your disgusting life.
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I'm sorry for unifying the map making community. I'm sorry for hosting (U) in their time of need when they asked. I'm sorry making an error when joining clan (U) which was obviously a misinterpretation of "taking over the clan". I'm sorry for creating a map making site which hosts thousands of other peoples downloads and hundreds of other peoples tutorials and almost a million posts which helped map makers learn more and become better.
You may call me what you want, but you post right now on my very creation. If you truly think that way then you are a hypocrite to your own words. I actually have played starcraft ever since I left, not as often but with friends under another handle. I left to go program an open source software which I worked very hard on as my next step in unifying communities and interacting with people with similar interests.
I didn't even have anything to do with the creation of the program, I only support it. If you have beef then its not with me.
I am truly sorry.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Arbitrary on 2006-09-05 at 22:21:57
This is like the endless creationism debate.