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The legions of Kerrigan have finally invaded the sacred planet of Shakuras. Here marks the final battle on the planet. Will the Zerg Swarm desolate the planet, or will the Protoss-Terran alliance remain uncontested?

I have decided to use a slightly different approach on this map. As always, feedback and comments are appreciated.

By the way, in case you haven't noticed, all of my melee maps are (and/or will be) related to the campaign storyline.

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6 oclock has the ramps closer to them, as well as the expo. Without looking at anything else, the positions are imbalanced.

First thing that jumps out at me is that red can be cliffed and blue can't. Next is that there aren't really any natural expansions. There are other flaws but I don't feel like listing them.

Don't get discouraged, this is a little harsh but it's all true. You should start playing on PGT and get good or watch some replays to get the jist of how games are played out.

First thing I noticed looking at the thumbnail image, is that it looks too damn like your other map.


http://www.staredit.net/index.php?act=Atta...pe=post&id=7156
http://www.staredit.net/index.php?act=Atta...pe=post&id=7142

Its unoriginal. Yeah, its a different map, but the concept is the same. You just rotated the start locations, but you almost have the same map.


EDIT: And again, the same problems. Just keep the minerals at the main together, instead of surrounding the damn start. Move the minerals on the ground expos so that its against the walls, instead of leaving them vulernable to easy attack.

The only way from the left side to the right side is through the ramps, which makes it difficult to move around. And those land areas on the far right and left will only be useful while ground units are in transit. Obviously, no one will put themselves in there just for a battle.

Thank you for your comments. Now here's my argument:

To ihatett:

First off, the fact that the ramps face blue is negated because the ramps are actually closer the red (just above the line of symmetry).

Secondly, the four ground expos on the side are the same distance from each main. As the previously stated sentence is true, therefore the middle expansion is the same distance from both mains. While it is geographically closer to blue than red, the time it takes for a ground unit to get there is marginal.

To PsychoTemplar:

Red's cliffability is troublesome but unavoidable on this setup. There are the two possible alternatives: I make red uncliffable or blue cliffable. Since the first is basically impossible, I'm going to implement the second. Thanks for pointing that out.

On natural expansions: I personally don't like them because they convey a sense of safety "If I lose my other expo, at least I still have economy inflow from my (usually) easy-to-defend natural," is a statement I don't exactly like too much. I am aware that this is a setback for Zerg. However, I don't see a spot where I can put a natural on this map (or, for that matter, my previous map). Should I design my map in the beginning so that there will always be a spot for a natural?

Other flaws: Unless you don't have enough time or another reason, please don't hesitate to point out the problems. If you don't, how can I possibly improve beyond what I learn?

Discouragment: Don't worry. I'm not easily discouraged. Guess it's one of those things that are hereditary. "Harshness" from people who comment on my work is nothing compared to what I'm used to.

I play SC, just not on the PGT level. Who knows, in the future I might. As for replays, for "External Replays" folder is 16 megabytes. As the name suggests, those are replays I download off of places like TL. The other 8 megs of my replay folder is constituted of my own games.

And now I really have to go.

No, I mean it is easier to seige that expo, etc. Also, since the ramps all point downward, 6 oclock could more easily control 12's choke point by taking the cliff infront of their main. 12 can't do the same to 6.

I think you should make the center high ground normal dirt, then you can make thin high dirt around it and put an expo there. In other words, do to the top part of the middle with what you did with the bottom.

You mean like this?

[attachmentid=7206]

In fact, I like this setup better. If no one finds anything offensive about it, I'll modify the first screen and the download.

z/p > t on this map.

Two huge chokes right next to the mineral line = gg tvp, tvz.

Also, in zvp zerg has no nat... so you are basically forcing this map to be all rushes.

Too much vespene gas.
The middle, I would rather that there were resorces in each pouch, you know what i mean?

Alaso, I think Ihatett has a point (do you have a name? calling you ihatett is odd...) This map is against terran, i think this is mostly a toss map. No quick expos for zerg either.

More modifications made. Added naturals. I'm not sure what I should put in them so I did 4 minerals and a gas. Changed middle (resources in each pouch). Changed base layout to reduce general defenselessness.

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Explain your reasoning in blocking off main's minerals. I sort of like it, but it doesn't really work.






While it does help block off your peons from an early attack (unless you are zerg), anything else you build will be out in the open. And it will be very, very alone because your peons will take forever to come and help protect it (they will get stuck trying to get out). Imagine how vulnerable a gateway would be to lings, or a rax to zeals. No matter what you do, a rush would be inevitable and hard to stop. Ranged units on the outside would be hard to get to, and invinble to the peons.


Also, you have strange open triangles which tanks can perch on and in.

EDIT: It has certainly improved though.

This is completely conceptual and expanding on my original idea of mineral-line walling. I think this design compensates for some of the reasons mentioned above.

The triangle-shaped objects were merely something to divide the two paths. It's been changed to water terrain.

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As for my reasoning why, it was part of a little theory my friends and I were discussing the other day. I decided I'd put it in a map and see what people thought about it.

Now, there is no main........ T___________________________________T

What is your rationale on imprisoning the start? Theres no room to build, and creates a problem if one were to build in one direction. The expos have at least twice the building room! And why dont you keep the minerals in the main clustered together?

Too symmetrical for my tastes.

EDIT: While youre at it, explain your theory on what those water triangles are supposed to do. I see it just dividing the path and allow tanks to pop any outcoming ground units.

Just for fun I thought I'd try something new in this forum. Without looking, I downloaded map and head straight to Bnet to find a random person to play. Upon game launch the guy wrote, "cya!" Yikes man! There was no place to Start?

Looking at the original post's picture, this was a better map? This map wasn't easy to create I'm sure. The symmetry you managed to build looks very time-consuming and hard work. You have obviously somewhat mastered the terrain aspect of map-making, as I could never build anything this intricate. The flow, strategy, and theme however may be the hardest part to learn. I can only suggest to start out by possibly using a well established map as a guide, try to somewhat "copy" it's theme. In any kind of art, students should copy masters as a learning stage. Once you understand what they're doing... then move out to establish your own Style. The basics need to be learned first tho. I think you need to stop trying to "fix" this map and start new. You've learned a lot and show a lot of potential and willingness to learn. My advice is to move on with what you've learned!

I am definitely still in basic training.

My original theory with this was to make the players get out of their main. While I'm not quite sure if this is a valid concept or not, but I think you all have proved it to me.

Anywho, this map is going into my "Concepts" and is probably staying there.

A new map is beginning now.

Unless you are very good at Starcraft, don't try to force weird strategies on people, because you won't know how players will actually react, or whether it will be balanced at all.

Point taken. I'll try to incorporate some "normal" strategies in my next one.

I dont like the mains at all. Where are terran and toss supposed to build? They are space consuming races. I dont like the walled in minerals.
Baja, this terrain, in no way at all, is mastered.
No room to build, unbalanced and i just dont see what is appealing about it.

Sorry if this post sounds harsh, but this map went downhill. Take away the blocked in mains, make more room for them and I would like it more.

Yenku, I meant Gladius has mastered the terrain building aspect i.e. how to use Staredit,forge,etc. His map is very "artistic". A person who has never played starcraft would find the intricate and difficult patterns more "eye-catching" than say a Rose-of-dream's map. I think Gladius is a very artistic person and just needs to learn how to manipulate his artistic terrain into a "playable" form.