Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-14 at 13:32:53
I'm going to do this here, since I'm only about 30% done with it right now. Once I hit about 80, I'll create a topic about it in the modding forums. Anyway, a couple of q/a first(this I'll copy/change when i make the new topic, don't hesitate to ask more):
Q. Is there going to be support for previous tools/aka importing Memgraft/Stargraft files?
A. Eventually, how about it works right for itself first?
Q. How is it going to apply patches?
A. Through the use of an MPQDraft plugin. Keeps the size down, you see.
Q. What is the button preview?
A. Okay, the button preview. This is a display on the button editor that will show you the current set you have loaded. So, if you have the Advanced Terran Build selected, you'll see the set. On top of just showing the set, support for the current requirements allows for dynamic changing of the set. In other words, if you have a barracks and are on the move command, you'll see all the buttons for if it is lifted off. Switch to the Marine build button, and you'll see the different build buttons. The following things are supported this way:
Burrow
Cloak
Cancels
Lifted off
Harvesting
Q. What happened to the "Number of Buttons" in the unit commands?
A. Gone. No more of that. You just have to tell which set you want, and the program will set that for you on its own. Too often have people forgotten to change that and ask 'Where are my buttons?'
Q. How about requirements, what are you doing for them?
A. They are going to be in a list fashion instead of the trackbar. It is up to the user right now to make it a valid requirement. However, all the different opcodes are properly identified.
Q. When is SC Firegraft coming out?
A. When the interface is done(IE, it will save and the plugin is done), I'll do an early beta for those members of the SEN Mod team who want to test, plus selected others. Exe edits will be next. After the closed beta, I'll make an 'open' beta, updating bugs as they come.
Q. How big is the application going to be?
A. I don't know yet. Because I'm using BCB6 to create it, the size/mem usage is going to be comparable to DatEdit. Right now, the exe is ~900kb in size. I know, a lot bigger than memgraft, but it's going to be that much more powerful, hopefully.
List of items that are going to be exe edits:
1. ID's. If it has an ID, you can change it. Example: Siege Mode will have 4 different ID's to change. This is a lot of them
2. Spell times. Yes, I said spell times. Example: How long Stimpack lasts.
3. Internal Timers. These are timers for stuff like Shields/HP Regen/Red Zone Burn time.
4. Spell amounts. How about 10 Broodlings, eh?
5. Restricts for race on some orders. Example: Repair for all mechanical items.
6. Spell overlay ID's. Green Plague, Red Defensive Matrix?
7. Code inclusion. This is up to the data file creator(s)(which right now is me) to decide where/what. How about multiplayer actions? New Iscript.bin definitions for the unused entries?
8. Ummm, your choice? Suggestions for this are open.
So, I'll get some screens and I want your feedback. It's actually easier to get it right the first time instead of having to go back and fix stuff, so plz help now. If people ask and want to know, you have permission to share anything in here with them. It's just not out in a public forum so if something bad happens I don't have a many people knowing how much is exactly done/not done or expecting things to go at a constant rate. It's trying to be less like DW/SI when it comes to this.
ADDITION
Screens!! You can see what they are of. Note the button preview is heavily shown off.
Comments wanted.
Q. Is there going to be support for previous tools/aka importing Memgraft/Stargraft files?
A. Eventually, how about it works right for itself first?
Q. How is it going to apply patches?
A. Through the use of an MPQDraft plugin. Keeps the size down, you see.
Q. What is the button preview?
A. Okay, the button preview. This is a display on the button editor that will show you the current set you have loaded. So, if you have the Advanced Terran Build selected, you'll see the set. On top of just showing the set, support for the current requirements allows for dynamic changing of the set. In other words, if you have a barracks and are on the move command, you'll see all the buttons for if it is lifted off. Switch to the Marine build button, and you'll see the different build buttons. The following things are supported this way:
Burrow
Cloak
Cancels
Lifted off
Harvesting
Q. What happened to the "Number of Buttons" in the unit commands?
A. Gone. No more of that. You just have to tell which set you want, and the program will set that for you on its own. Too often have people forgotten to change that and ask 'Where are my buttons?'
Q. How about requirements, what are you doing for them?
A. They are going to be in a list fashion instead of the trackbar. It is up to the user right now to make it a valid requirement. However, all the different opcodes are properly identified.
Q. When is SC Firegraft coming out?
A. When the interface is done(IE, it will save and the plugin is done), I'll do an early beta for those members of the SEN Mod team who want to test, plus selected others. Exe edits will be next. After the closed beta, I'll make an 'open' beta, updating bugs as they come.
Q. How big is the application going to be?
A. I don't know yet. Because I'm using BCB6 to create it, the size/mem usage is going to be comparable to DatEdit. Right now, the exe is ~900kb in size. I know, a lot bigger than memgraft, but it's going to be that much more powerful, hopefully.
List of items that are going to be exe edits:
1. ID's. If it has an ID, you can change it. Example: Siege Mode will have 4 different ID's to change. This is a lot of them
2. Spell times. Yes, I said spell times. Example: How long Stimpack lasts.
3. Internal Timers. These are timers for stuff like Shields/HP Regen/Red Zone Burn time.
4. Spell amounts. How about 10 Broodlings, eh?
5. Restricts for race on some orders. Example: Repair for all mechanical items.
6. Spell overlay ID's. Green Plague, Red Defensive Matrix?
7. Code inclusion. This is up to the data file creator(s)(which right now is me) to decide where/what. How about multiplayer actions? New Iscript.bin definitions for the unused entries?
8. Ummm, your choice? Suggestions for this are open.
So, I'll get some screens and I want your feedback. It's actually easier to get it right the first time instead of having to go back and fix stuff, so plz help now. If people ask and want to know, you have permission to share anything in here with them. It's just not out in a public forum so if something bad happens I don't have a many people knowing how much is exactly done/not done or expecting things to go at a constant rate. It's trying to be less like DW/SI when it comes to this.
ADDITION
Screens!! You can see what they are of. Note the button preview is heavily shown off.
Comments wanted.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Corbo(MM) on 2006-02-14 at 18:31:30
lol sounds so great, 10 broodlings woot
i dont think size matters as long as you finish it woot, we are thirsty but not for blood but for firegraft omg omg omg
ADDITION:
man, i dont know what to say omg omg thx doa for such a good program omg the button preview! now we will see how it looks in the game omg we wont need to test anymore! (lol, we would need to test if it works but screw it)
i like it
have u ever considered how it would be if the program actually changes everything for you i mean, like in that button preview you select a slot from 1-9 for example i pick 5 and i want burrow to move so i click on the slot and buttons appear! like a list but with pics!, omg
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Voyager7456(MM) on 2006-02-14 at 18:32:18
Sounds great, DoA. I have a few questions, about what is possible/what is planned:
1) Custom button groups (Ex. Create New Button Group from StarGraft/MemGraft)
2) Cast-on-Self targets. I'd do ANNNYTHING for a cast on self target...
3) Changing attack targets? (Ex. Having the Marine's attack only effect Buildings, etc.)
4) Magical device to stop Blizzard from releasing patches?
Wow, I've been sitting here for half an hour and I can only think of 3 questions. FireGraft pretty much squelches any modding annoyance I've ever had.
I feel like a 6-year-old on the day before Christmas...
Good luck DoA, and looking forward to FG's release...
EDIT:
Screens....
Look... awesome...
I have a few questions, about what is possible/what is planned:1) Custom button groups (Ex. Create New Button Group from StarGraft/MemGraft)
2) Cast-on-Self targets. I'd do ANNNYTHING for a cast on self target...
3) Changing attack targets? (Ex. Having the Marine's attack only effect Buildings, etc.)
4) Magical device to stop Blizzard from releasing patches?
Wow, I've been sitting here for half an hour and I can only think of 3 questions. FireGraft pretty much squelches any modding annoyance I've ever had.
I feel like a 6-year-old on the day before Christmas...
Good luck DoA, and looking forward to FG's release...
EDIT:
Screens....
Look... awesome...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-14 at 18:52:31
Voyager's questions:
Q. Will there be custom button groups?
A. Yes, of course there will be. I'd never do this program without them. I'm going to make sure that the rename to work before I release anything.(Memgraft uses know about this...)
Q. Self Targeting?
A. I'll look into it. I guess that it just checks the offsets, but if it is any harder than that, it might not be possible. We'll see...
Q. CASM?
A. Umm, of course. The traditional SG/MG way of adding actions is being kept, and combined with additional code will create the way for amazing new spells. Like such, the afterburners I tried to recreate were an early example of this.
Q. Attack Targets?
A. Not so easy. Don't expect to be able to do it, but I'm never up for not looking. That would be a good sport, now would it? Anyway, because of the way targets are looked at, it might be possible to add a code to check, but it would require some good asm knowledge to interpret it afterward.
(I can't resist)
Q. A super-anti-Blizzard-don't-you-dare-release-anymore-patches-and-screw-the-modding-community-(not to mention some EUD conditions)-over-ever-again-and-again-and-why-didn't-you-just-go-to-1.14-and-leave-it-alone-for-good function?
A. ROFL!!!! No, I can't do that, although it would be nice. I can do the two next best things. First, an externally updated data file, so that anyone who can hex edit can update some stuff. Second, release it open-source, after it is commented!!(You'd hate to see the code right now, it looks like someone threw up all over roadkill, then drove over it again). The format for the data file isn't too hard, people just need to know what to look for.
Q. Will there be custom button groups?
A. Yes, of course there will be. I'd never do this program without them. I'm going to make sure that the rename to work before I release anything.(Memgraft uses know about this...)
Q. Self Targeting?
A. I'll look into it. I guess that it just checks the offsets, but if it is any harder than that, it might not be possible. We'll see...
Q. CASM?
A. Umm, of course. The traditional SG/MG way of adding actions is being kept, and combined with additional code will create the way for amazing new spells. Like such, the afterburners I tried to recreate were an early example of this.
Q. Attack Targets?
A. Not so easy. Don't expect to be able to do it, but I'm never up for not looking. That would be a good sport, now would it? Anyway, because of the way targets are looked at, it might be possible to add a code to check, but it would require some good asm knowledge to interpret it afterward.
(I can't resist)
Q. A super-anti-Blizzard-don't-you-dare-release-anymore-patches-and-screw-the-modding-community-(not to mention some EUD conditions)-over-ever-again-and-again-and-why-didn't-you-just-go-to-1.14-and-leave-it-alone-for-good function?
A. ROFL!!!! No, I can't do that, although it would be nice. I can do the two next best things. First, an externally updated data file, so that anyone who can hex edit can update some stuff. Second, release it open-source, after it is commented!!(You'd hate to see the code right now, it looks like someone threw up all over roadkill, then drove over it again). The format for the data file isn't too hard, people just need to know what to look for.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Forsaken on 2006-02-14 at 23:05:39
Wow... 
Voyager took the questions from me...
Really look forward to using this.
Maybe if you need testers, you could realease a beta for the MOD Team? Just a question. Not a demand.
Voyager took the questions from me...
Really look forward to using this.
Maybe if you need testers, you could realease a beta for the MOD Team? Just a question. Not a demand.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2006-02-15 at 01:38:57
Looks sick but isnt my cup of tea.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Forsaken on 2006-02-15 at 01:45:58
QUOTE(Kept_Wheat @ Feb 14 2006, 10:38 PM)
Looks sick but isnt my cup of tea.
[right][snapback]427670[/snapback][/right]
[right][snapback]427670[/snapback][/right]
What is?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2006-02-15 at 01:47:31
Data modding. I dont know what i am supposed to do therfor i do no work. We need more direction.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Forsaken on 2006-02-15 at 01:56:01
That could do it.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-15 at 10:34:36
QUOTE(Forsaken @ Feb 14 2006, 09:05 PM)
Wow...
Voyager took the questions from me...
Really look forward to using this.
Maybe if you need testers, you could realease a beta for the MOD Team? Just a question. Not a demand.
[right][snapback]427515[/snapback][/right]
Voyager took the questions from me...
Really look forward to using this.
Maybe if you need testers, you could realease a beta for the MOD Team? Just a question. Not a demand.
[right][snapback]427515[/snapback][/right]
QUOTE(DiscipleOfAdun @ Feb 14 2006, 11:32 AM)
Q. When is SC Firegraft coming out?
A. When the interface is done(IE, it will save and the plugin is done), I'll do an early beta for those members of the SEN Mod team who want to test. Exe edits will be next. Once the open function is began, an open beta will happen, followed by changes/revisions/fixes and then the final release. After that, a program to do asm actions is planned.
I'd never leave you guys out. Why else would the topic be here right now? Any SEN-Mod team member is eligible for the first beta, when it happens.
Okay, addressing the buttons. I could try to make the preview so that clicking on it moves the current button there, but it would make for some really bad collisions in the code for displaying the buttons. The add set buttons will already make it so much easier, so I don't see what trying to do that will get me.
Now, as for the requires(Units/Upg/TechRes/TechUse/Orders), what are your ideas on how to make the show up. I'm not liking the trackbar idea from SG/MG. I think there's an easier way that the user will also be able to see every requirement, but what is your opinions?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Forsaken on 2006-02-15 at 10:49:03
Maybe I should sleep before asking stupid questions. 
DoA, you rule.
DoA, you rule.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-02-15 at 20:32:20
Voy kinda covered my questions.
1) Can you upload the screenshots on an external host since FF is being retarded and is now parsing them as SCX files (or maybe Moose is screwing with the code)?
1) Can you upload the screenshots on an external host since FF is being retarded and is now parsing them as SCX files (or maybe Moose is screwing with the code)?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Forsaken on 2006-02-15 at 21:16:10
QUOTE(DT_Battlekruser @ Feb 15 2006, 05:32 PM)
Voy kinda covered my questions.
1) Can you upload the screenshots on an external host since FF is being retarded and is now parsing them as SCX files (or maybe Moose is screwing with the code)?
[right][snapback]428127[/snapback][/right]
1) Can you upload the screenshots on an external host since FF is being retarded and is now parsing them as SCX files (or maybe Moose is screwing with the code)?
[right][snapback]428127[/snapback][/right]
It's has to do with the SCX. Moose said he had no idea why it is doing this(?).
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-02-16 at 01:25:47
It used to read a content type: text//html header and spit out the ASCII of the image. Now it tries to open "meh.scx" (new).
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-16 at 09:41:30
I'll try to switch them over sometime. I'm actually not supposed to be on right now....
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-02-18 at 02:04:30
Never mind, Moose fixxored attachments. Sexy!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-18 at 20:28:33
Okay, let's see now. I've got the buttons all keeping data and the little '...' buttons for the vars working today...Yay!!!
So, a question(the more feedback on this, the better). How should the add button action work? And the add button set? BTW, don't worry about locations being off, I've written a nice routine for sorting the buttons based on position(another thing about Memgraft that makes me mad). So, What you you all think? I'm thinking for right now to do something like the Stargraft adding for new button sets, where you can have it copy another set or create a blank one. But I've go no plans for the single buttons, so please help.
So, a question(the more feedback on this, the better). How should the add button action work? And the add button set? BTW, don't worry about locations being off, I've written a nice routine for sorting the buttons based on position(another thing about Memgraft that makes me mad). So, What you you all think? I'm thinking for right now to do something like the Stargraft adding for new button sets, where you can have it copy another set or create a blank one. But I've go no plans for the single buttons, so please help.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Voyager7456(MM) on 2006-02-18 at 22:11:38
Yeah, I really like the StarGraft system, that'd be a good choice. I'm not sure what you mean by adding single buttons... wouldn't you just pick what button group to add it to?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-02-19 at 01:59:47
For the single button just having it get auto-added to the next blank space on the selected button set with a default action and condition would work.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-20 at 11:29:47
Yeah, that's what I thought of to begin with. So, between the adding buttons and the reqs, I've got my hands full for quite a while...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2006-02-22 at 02:11:10
And here i thought this was almost done.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-27 at 10:50:34
Umm, no. There's been a setback or two.... like I can't get at the source(or any of my modding tools) right now...which isn't good.
ADDITION:
Okay, I know this is going to merge, but...
I've got the requirements fields working!!!! YA!! Considering I'm not even supposed to be on the computer that the source is on, that is a major achievement for me. I don't have screens for it yet, but I'm quite confident that it works well. Only the upgrade switches are causing a bit of trouble, but that's just because I didn't have time to fix it.
ADDITION:
Okay, I know this is going to merge, but...
I've got the requirements fields working!!!! YA!! Considering I'm not even supposed to be on the computer that the source is on, that is a major achievement for me. I don't have screens for it yet, but I'm quite confident that it works well. Only the upgrade switches are causing a bit of trouble, but that's just because I didn't have time to fix it.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Pauper on 2006-02-27 at 20:55:56
Can you please make this as accurate as possible! I saw one thing i didnt like: SCv not Terran SCV. Please make it very accurate, make it better then Arsenal III.
Can you treach me to program good? I dont know how to make it edit game data, or like a editor. Please teach me!
Can you treach me to program good? I dont know how to make it edit game data, or like a editor. Please teach me!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Forsaken on 2006-02-27 at 21:31:08
QUOTE(Pauper @ Feb 27 2006, 05:55 PM)
Can you please make this as accurate as possible! I saw one thing i didnt like: SCv not Terran SCV. Please make it very accurate, make it better then Arsenal III.
Can you treach me to program good? I dont know how to make it edit game data, or like a editor. Please teach me!
[right][snapback]436042[/snapback][/right]
Can you treach me to program good? I dont know how to make it edit game data, or like a editor. Please teach me!
[right][snapback]436042[/snapback][/right]
It's not something DoA has time for... I would know!
Imo, a good place to start with game editing is learning a few programming languages. C, C++, C#, Javascrip(?) and just kind of mess around things. It's nothing that can be learned in a weekend. Unless you spend every second on it!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DiscipleOfAdun on 2006-02-28 at 10:01:36
You know, there is a very good reason for not having the race next to the unit. I like the fact that the lists I use can be keyed so that you jump based off the key you press. If I put the race in front of each, you just be going "Terran ...","Terran ...", etc, when you press 't', and you won't jump to any unit any other way. I originally had the race in front of each name, but it got to the point that if I wanted to find something, I'd have just scroll down the list, and I'm in a big time saving mood right now. Besides, all the names are right, there just isn't any races on them.
As for learning how to program, I'm going to say learn C++ first. I did a backwards thing and learned most of assmebly before I learned c++(which made it that much easier and harder to learn).
And Forsaken is right about time. I tried to first learn how to program about 5 years ago. I've only become fairly good at it in the past year.
As for learning how to program, I'm going to say learn C++ first. I did a backwards thing and learned most of assmebly before I learned c++(which made it that much easier and harder to learn).
And Forsaken is right about time. I tried to first learn how to program about 5 years ago. I've only become fairly good at it in the past year.