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Staredit Network -> Serious Discussion -> Outer Space.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by SkiLLz on 2006-08-17 at 03:18:08
One time at school, during art class while we were painting, my friends and I somehow brought up the topic of outter space. We talked through the entire 80 minute class about it. How do you feel about it?

I think that it is amazing that it goes on for infinite. Just the concept of not knowing what it is really like up there is what makes this topic so interesting. Black holes are points of gravity that suck in what comes close enough. There is one myth that the closer you are to gravity the faster time goes by. One thing that I have always thought deeply about is life in outter space. Do you think there is life out there? I feel like if we are here on Earth, the chances of there being life somewhere else out there is very high if you ask me. Another thing I find amazing is how old the universe is and how did it get here? Has it always been here? Is the Big Bang theory true? If it is just think about how amazing that would be. Sometimes I gaze at the nightsky and just think about what could possibly be out there. As funny as this sounds, Sylvia Brown (The Phycic) claims that around 2080 or so, aliens will come to Earth and help us. I don't think her theory is correct, but wouldn't that simply be amazing?

So, what is your outlook on this topic? How do you believe the Universe came to be. How do you feel about black holes and life in outter space and all that? Please post.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rantent on 2006-08-17 at 03:36:07
QUOTE
There is one myth that the closer you are to gravity the faster time goes by.
Slower actually.

Space, to me is a vast untapped resource. It is unexplored and unknown. Heck, the smallest things we can see in our own system must be roughly 100 meters in diameter. There could be so much more than what we simply see, as we can only comprehend the light comming from distant starts and that which is reflected off of other giant bodies close to us. It is the chaotic illusion of peace.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mp)7-7 on 2006-08-18 at 06:45:52
Rantent it right, that is why when you get sucked into a black hole, time is stopped so you will look like you never died to the outside world, even long after your death.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Vampire on 2006-08-18 at 18:39:51
For me it's just amazing that when you're looking up at the stars you're not 100% sure if the thing you're looking at still exists, because light can travel only at certain speed and some stars that we can still see in the sky might've been destroyed thousands of years ago.

I think that there is definetly another life in the universe, if it's true that it's infinite then there must be another form of life. For me just the fact that the universe is infinite is scary.

I don't believe the alien stuff though, I'm not saying they don't exist i'm just saying i don't believe they like visit earth regularly and like that people actualy have seen them, i also don't believe in crop circles and all that stuff. I think they like might've vistited earth like once or twice but even if they did nobody knows about it, and other stuff that we know about is consipiracy bull crap or something like that.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CAFG4reals on 2006-08-18 at 20:48:43
A topic that doesnt involve debating, just "liek, woah dood" stuff is refreshing.
I think I could seriously spend a whole night on my roof just phathoming stuff while starring at the stars.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Lord_Agamemnon(MM) on 2006-08-18 at 21:29:40
I believe in the Big Bang--please, let's not get into an argument--and I believe that there is probably intelligent life somewhere else in the universe. What really shocks me, however is the scale of it all. Amusingly enough, the first time I ever realized how small a planet actually is was when I was watching a demo for Spore. When you think about it, it's astonishing. Your city seems large, and compared to that the Earth is huge. Well, compared to the solar system, Earth is a dust speck, and the solar system is completely insignificant on a galactic scale. And then the whole galaxy is tiny compared to outer space. Infinity is even harder to imagine...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by SkiLLz on 2006-08-19 at 00:47:07
QUOTE(7-7 @ Aug 18 2006, 06:45 AM)
Rantent it right, that is why when you get sucked into a black hole, time is stopped so you will look like you never died to the outside world, even long after your death.
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Well, the way you said it makes it sound like your traveling time. Really in your view, time would go by at the same speed, so the outside world as you said would just watch you get slower and slower and eventually not want to watch... wait I'm not sure how that would work. Lol. I had it said in my head but I tried typing it and I made myself think. Forget I said anything ermm.gif . Someone please bail me out of this, Because you aren't traveling time are you? Other wise people that live on mountains would be in different time zones then people living in a ditch.... right?

As far as the Big Bang theory goes, everything exploding from a point of singularity at millions of degrees is very hard to believe. If I recall correctly, Everything happened in minutes like the first molecules were formed after so many minutes. I just don't think that everything we know today would fit in a fricken hole blink.gif . It just doesn't make sence (in my mind atleast) for and explosion to occur out of know where creating matter, time, and eventually life.

Another thing I like to wonder about is a parallel universe. Also, does the universe come to an end? It has too... It cant just go on forever can it...??? If it does, is it full or are we one part of it that is expanding into infinite? Could you travel 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 lightyears in one direction and come across something? Or would we just keep going and going (Maybe we should send the enegizer bunny out there bleh.gif )

As far as I can see so far, we are all basically on the same page about beliefes about life and size. That's too bad too because there wont be any debate crazy.gif .

This post was pretty long...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Centreri on 2006-08-19 at 01:20:25
In my opinion, time is often a matter of perception, so it could easily slow down or speed up for you depending on the situation.

Space, to me, is an unknown openness with millions of opportunities. It is, like Rantent said, a great resource with anything we might want or need, but is currently out of our reach.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by SkiLLz on 2006-08-19 at 02:55:53
QUOTE(Centreri @ Aug 19 2006, 01:20 AM)
In my opinion, time is often a matter of perception, so it could easily slow down or speed up for you depending on the situation.
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Thankyou. biggrin.gif

Now this brings me into another question. Could you spend I don't know, one year where there is basically 0 gravity then come back to earth and be in the future? Even though going by perception, it is always present day but I'm pretty sure we all know what I meant bleh.gif . Time is very complicated.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Lithium on 2006-08-20 at 07:18:55
Time is only a perception we are calling how things go by. Time always existed if we view time as something as if it exists.
Gravity doesn't necessarily slow down time. Only a misconception created by the stupidity of our race.

I could rather imagine a relativistic space travel while you are frozen in cryo chamber, and come back to earth and find it in the future.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by FallenDreamer on 2006-08-22 at 23:42:48
Right, time would more accurately be described as a measurement. It measures the rates of change in any entity. Time never speeds up, but the rate of change in an object can be sped up or slowed down.


Outer space, hm... I don't think it goes on forever... that wouldn't be right.... but I think, for the world to exist, there must be a way to create energy, and therefore, matter. Likewise, I think space only exists when objects occupy it. Without energy, in any form, there is no existing space.

So, the only way to stop an infinite spectrum into the past is to have a way for energy to be created. The laws of physics state in impossible, but the laws of physics are human perceptions. Although I do remember a case of 'virtual particles' being created during the creation of particles. The virtual particles appeared in order to assist the transition, and disappeared afterwards. It was strange, and I don't fully understand it, but who knows?

So, yeah. I think space isn't infinite, and I'm pretty sure scientists don't think so either. However, it should be capable of both expanding or imploding. Let's hope it doesn't expand or explode constantly, cause that would suck for us.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Who-the-hell-ru on 2006-08-23 at 14:24:17
I read tons of textbooks on this and did a 1500 word essay on it, so I guess I have quite a lot to argue about it.

First of all, I would say outer space, or universe is infinite, in a way. I call it infinite because it is mainly empty space with objects and debris. But when objects have not been formed pass a region, it is still considered space and part of the universe, but is instead called a void or "the edge of the universe". So space IS infinite it you think about it cause nothing IS space.
As for the Big Bang theory, I agree with most of it. Except for the part where space is created upon the big bang, and continually expands. Space is empty, and does not expand because it just is, theres nothing. However, the planets, moons, stars, etc, had to come from somewhere, so I believe matter built up, like an nuclear bomb would. I can't explain how matter appeared to create the big bang theory, however.

Alien life? Of course! How can there not be other life? But wether they have been visiting us, I doubt that. Most shows/books that have tried to spread the rumor of ufo's, is just...idiotic. I have found pictures that were doctored unprofessionally, cameras that took pictures of leaves/string and called it ufos. People that claimed to have been abducted, puh-leez! "When I woke up...I wasn't where I was suppose to be, I was in the kitchen..." (Heard of sleepwalking?)
"I noticed had these small skin indents on the side of my thighs when I woke up.." (Try your clothes into your skin, or lay on them, you'll get it like that).
Call me a ignorant fool, call me an idiot. But i'd rather live without the thoughts of possibly hostile aliens, and that there is a rational explaination for everything. Being oblivious is bliss.

Time, it's unexplainable. It's been here, and will be here, like space, it's there, but just isn't. We call it time, but it's just used as a measurement of...length...in....time..whatever. There's belief that there are parallel universes, or that time is doubled, tripled, quadrupled, etc. for each decision that we make.

QUOTE
Time is only a perception we are calling how things go by.

Possibly the only thing I agree with 100%

QUOTE
Really in your view, time would go by at the same speed, so the outside world as you said would just watch you get slower and slower

Theres something that theorized that goes with this, it's called statsis. Time passes rapidly outside, while you are "frozen in time"

Heres a couple pictures for you to feast on.

user posted image

user posted image

user posted image
Report, edit, etc...Posted by FallenDreamer on 2006-08-23 at 17:29:19
QUOTE(Who-the-hell-ru @ Aug 23 2006, 12:23 PM)

Heres a couple pictures for you to feast on.

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Hot damn. That's one road trip I'll never get done...

I see where you're going with the 'nothing is space' thing. But technically, space only exists if some sort of energy occupies it. Everything else is just potential space. When energy spreads, more space is created/taken up.

Matter being built up, that's easy. The Big Bang solves that theory very easily. Gluons (very basic form of energy, think of it as sub-atomic goo) become sub-atomic particles, which then combine(they have to, since there's so many. It's impossible to avoid at that point.) to form atoms. Groups of low-level atoms aka Hydrogen would burn because of the mass amounts of energy, and at high enough levels, would go through particle fusion to create higher level atoms, aka helium, oxygen, even iron(that'll take one helluva heat source), although it's a wonder how we have all of those on earth. Granted, it's only in small amounts, but still, and this is just on the surface too...

(forgive me if some of that doesn't make sense, I haven't done any physics related stuff in, like, 2 years.)

About that aliens thing... we're probably not gonna meet any personally in our lifetime, but there is some interesting stuff out there. Have you seen the picture of the face on Mars? Large structure, looks somewhat like the a sphinx, but more like a lion. Mars is/should be empty right now, but it's entirely possible that at one point, it was occupied.

Also, the asteroid belt, very suspicious. Some people think it may have formerly been a plant, or a few planets, but went kaboom. It's entirely possible, you never know.

But that's not important. We'll worry about that when space travel is commonplace and doesn't take years to prepare for.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Who-the-hell-ru on 2006-08-23 at 18:59:24
QUOTE
I see where you're going with the 'nothing is space' thing. But technically, space only exists if some sort of energy occupies it. Everything else is just potential space. When energy spreads, more space is created/taken up.


What form of energy are you talking about here? Is it visible? Gaseous? Etc. I guess you can never know unless you've been in space. But from what it looks like, space = black. Black = nothing smile.gif Whatever, I'll leave it to the theorists and scientists to figure that out.

QUOTE
But that's not important. We'll worry about that when space travel is commonplace and doesn't take years to prepare for.
We'll all be dead. I'll see you in heaven/hell/purgatory/flying bhudda island!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by FallenDreamer on 2006-08-23 at 19:55:52
Black = lack of light heading in your direction. Blackness doesn't mean much. I'm talking about thinks like heat, light, and gluons, and other stuff like that. Matter also = energy, it just has form. There are neutral matter particles passing throuhg the earth everyday, and you wouldn't even notice them. They're so small, they can pass straight through your skin.

Anyway, yeah. There's a bunch of stuff, you should take a look in the Wiki Science section.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Who-the-hell-ru on 2006-08-24 at 03:43:37
Theres too much entries in wiki, theres more topics than...the dictionary.

But then, to prove a point, space with no particles, energy, matter, etc, still IS space. Thereforce, space is unlimited. biggrin.gif
Report, edit, etc...Posted by FallenDreamer on 2006-08-24 at 04:09:38
In that case, space would also be non-existant unless required.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Lithium on 2006-08-25 at 12:00:45
We perceive the universe as forever because it keeps expanding. And the distance to the edge of the universe is unknown and uncomprehendable by our puny race (if there are such a thing). pinch.gif I'd imagine the universe being some planetish thing to another bigger universe that view universes as planets.
The space as you know still holds particles and atoms. Just so thin you wouldn't be able to know it is there. There are like one atom per centimeter. So it is pretty void of any material.

And that is a vague description of "black" Black can be a thing that can absorb all light ( like the color black or the black hole ). Or void of light where light isnt reached seem black.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2006-08-25 at 23:07:44
In my opinion, the Big Bang theory is a load of crap. All their calculations say the universe began so and so years ago, then we finally pick up a faint glow of a star that's more than so and so lightyears away, so the Big Bang theorists just keep moving the beginning further and further back.

The universe never began, and will never end, in my opinion. It probably goes on forever, too, although I've been considering a sort of wormhole overlap sort of thing, so that the universe might be a four-dimensional sphere of sorts, very hard to explain. Infinity, however, is perfectly plausible. It's just that we take what we see on Earth and notice everything has a start and finish, beginning and end, etc. and apply it to everything else.

Other life UNDOUBTABLY exists. In fact, there was a mathematical equation done that estimated the chances of life evolving elsewhere in the universe, and it came out pretty damn high. Something like life per thirty solar-systems, or something. Very impressive, given the amount of solar-systems out there.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Syphon on 2006-08-28 at 10:38:45
QUOTE(Centreri @ Aug 19 2006, 12:20 AM)
In my opinion, time is often a matter of perception, so it could easily slow down or speed up for you depending on the situation.

Space, to me, is an unknown openness with millions of opportunities. It is, like Rantent said, a great resource with anything we might want or need, but is currently out of our reach.
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Perception of time is a mtter of perception. Time flies when you're having fun.

QUOTE(SkiLLz @ Aug 19 2006, 01:55 AM)
Thankyou. biggrin.gif

Now this brings me into another question. Could you spend I don't know, one year where there is basically 0 gravity then come back to earth and be in the future? Even though going by perception, it is always present day but I'm pretty sure we all know what I meant bleh.gif . Time is very complicated.
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Gravity doesn't slow down time, speed does (Which in turn affects your relative gravity). If you went close to the speed of light for 1 year and came back down 10 years would have passed. This would be exeedingly difficult because as you sped up you'd get heavier, requiring more fuel.

QUOTE(Lithium @ Aug 25 2006, 11:00 AM)
We perceive the universe as forever because it keeps expanding. And the distance to the edge of the universe is unknown and uncomprehendable by our puny race (if there are such a thing).  pinch.gif  I'd imagine the universe being some planetish thing to another bigger universe that view universes as planets.
The space as you know still holds particles and atoms. Just so thin you wouldn't be able to know it is there. There are like one atom per centimeter. So it is pretty void of any material.

And that is a vague description of "black" Black can be a thing that can absorb all light ( like the color black or the black hole ). Or void of light where light isnt reached seem black.
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The Universe is finite, but sphereical. Like traveling on the outside of a sphere, but softer. Because of this we could never get to the edge. And I'm sure long enough you'd fly right around and back to Earth.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by HolySin on 2006-08-31 at 21:15:39
QUOTE(Syphon(MM) @ Aug 28 2006, 08:38 AM)
The Universe is finite, but sphereical. Like traveling on the outside of a sphere, but softer. Because of this we could never get to the edge. And I'm sure long enough you'd fly right around and back to Earth.
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Basically, the idea that the universe is a loop that could never be traveled to the point where we would cross a point twice heading in one direction only because the universe has infinite dimensions. Not sure If I worded that right, but whatever.

Matter or energy can neither be created nor destroyed, rather it changes it's form. Don't forget this. For this very reason, I believe that the universe was never created, nor will it be destroyed. I believe the universe has always existed. I also believe that "nothing" does not exist. I know, sounds really redundant. However, referring back to the first law of thermodymacs, nothing in the universe will be destroyed. Rather, it will infinitely deteriorate exponentially. Since there is always something, there will never be nothing.

Just to amuse ourselves, let's say that every atom in the universe disappeared. We are left with the void of space. Is this truly nothing? Now suppose that one being was placed anywhere in this universe and could survive. That being would see black all around. The fact that he sees black means that the void is something, not nothing.

This is just some of my thoughts, but I honestly don't think "nothing" truly exists or ever will.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Pyro-Fire on 2006-09-02 at 06:49:48
http://macgyverpluto.ytmnd.com/

go go power pluto!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by WoodenFire on 2006-09-02 at 16:43:43
The physical dimensions of outerspace is not the outside of a sphere. The fabric of space is supported by that in that demonstrating that points that can never be reached, are the edges of the universe.

If the universe is expanding in all directions at the speed of light (not infinite), then we can never see or reach the edges because we do not have the capability to travel faster then light, nor do physics allow such emense speed.

If the universe is expanding at the speed of light, then we can never see the void outside of the universe, thus the model of a sphere where we are on the surface exists... this tells us of the limits of our technology, not of the actuality.

Take a look around, in space, you can go up/down/left/right and every 360degrees you could ever want... a sphere with us on the surface doesn't support that, if it was absolutely the shape of the universe, and not the conceptualization of the fabric or mechanics, then it would have different dimensions, with length being further then the height.

Physically, the universe should be a sphere (us being in the middle because all of matter should be focused in the middle of the expanding universe). Mechanically, we are traveling on an infinite surface, infinite only being stated because we can't travel faster than light to reach any end point.
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