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If I were anybody, I would take over the Oil Fields

You know, the gas prices these days... Who'd want to pass up this opportunity for some lower prices

chris this was a perfectly fine debate until... as kellimus said, you came in. Plz do not post in this thread again. I can't seem to remember when you have proven me wrong so I don't see how I can be mad about that. You have praised bush so don't say one thing and do another. So far you have picked fights with me obviously if you contiually try to "correct me" as you put it. So plz STFU and GTFO

Heres a little movie for you. I'm on the right, and your on the left picking a fight.



a very fine barbarque at that. Now get out and leave us to our food.

Also if you weren't such a bush supporter then why would you care if we're saying he sucks? Exactly, thought so.

What are you? 6?

add 10.

well you don't post like it...

I think you mean you're on the left, and he is on the right






So you try to argue against his posts because you assume he doesn't "Post" his age? I thought you were smarter then that.

I'm only going to take a few posts from your reply to mine, because it's full of flames and i'm not going to add to the fire.

First off, "I have not been proven wrong in the Middle East yet, maybe once"

You have still been proven wrong, even if it is just once. So it seems like to me, that you can't seem to make up your mind about anything. You have clearly shown it by the above quote I posted.

Second, you're "debating" (More like completely ignoring peoples points, just like Ihatett does, and saying we all are wrong, and you're right) with propaganda because you show NO PROOF about anything you say, even when it's about the military.

So you're throwing out fictional material claiming it is true, thus is being PROPAGANDA.

Third, Where does this "Bush Sucks, STARS does, too" come from? It sure isn't in THIS thread. So great job in spamming this thread with pointless arguments. I congradulate you.

Forth, I know nothing about being truthfull? Um.... Okay? You do? All you have done is fed the people of this forum your bull blam lies about the Middle East. Nothing you have said, that no one ALREADY KNOWS, is true. Everyone basicly KNOWS everything you try to "Prove". And i'm the one that doesn't know how to be truthfull?

And when did you have to "corret" me on something on this thread? When my views didn't appeal to you? And if i'm not mistakened, it's "Correct"

And my last one. When are my arguments "crumbling"? Not once have I had a "crumbling" argument in THIS thread. And when did I say the following: "Your just a Republican" "Anything a republican says is untruthful"?

True. You are a Republican. And most Republicans show a history of lieing to the people (Nixon with Watergate, Regan with Iran-Contra, Bush Sr. with Panama, and now Bush Jr. with Iraq). But did I say that ALL Republicans lie? No, I did not.

So basicly there, you twisted what I said to make it sound like I hate all Republicans. Which I do not.

You also tried to make an argument out of my "words". That does not work because the "words" I came up with are illusionary, and were created by you to create a shaky argument.

ON TOPIC
I guess you could say this war is a "War On Religion" because we ARE fighting Muslims... But the Muslims we are fighting have blown the Muslims rules waaaaaay out of proportion so they can have an excuse to kill inocent people. I don't know the Muslims book, but I doubt it says that you will get "71 brown haired virgins" by killing innocent people.

As in the words of Robin Williams: "These extremests probibly get into heaven and are all, 'where are my 71 brown haired virgins?' and then St. Peter sticks out his hands and says, 'Here are your 71 brown raisins' and drops them in their hands"

It's sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much funnier when you watch him do it on broadway >.<

You know... your kind of being racist saying that the only people who are terrorists are muslims. Terrorism affects every country, every race and every religion. Although you are right, the muslims that you are fighting probably can't even read, so when they are told that the qu'ran says something they will believe it and become corrupt.

Agreed terrorists have nothing to do with race and is just someone who wants to strike fear in a particular group death and chaos are just biproducts of it

If I implied that only Muslims were terrorists, i'm sorry. I did not mean to imply that because I know it isn't true.

There you go again, telling me I have twisted your posts/points..... I thought you were really smart, seriously I did, obviously in your ranting/flaming of me you couldn't see the 'meaning' behind my posts.

Tell me exactly where I have been untruthful in my posts.





yup, my post is fact, nothing fake here, so how is this not correcting anyhting? I mean I got my post right out of the Al Quada training manuel, and they are the ideal terrorists other terrorists look up to.


Kellimus, out of all our debates I have given the most proof between you and me, your statement is invalid about that.

Tell me exactly where I have ignored your points? Please please do tell, becuase you bring that up alot and never seem to back it up. I could easly say the same about you, you completely ignore my posts and seems to me you get into this anger and all you car about is flaming me and trying to act smart. Dude you just need to chill out...

On topic:

Yup, this is a war that is nearly impossible to win, as long as the many Arab news agencies only show the civilian deaths (which they are doing) only more terrorists will grow.

I believe they should show all deaths. Soldiers arn't the only ones in wars now. The problem is that soldiers should be taught going into a country how to spot the difference between a civillian who is going to shoot them or blow themselves up and a real civilian. The difference is hard to see but there are clues out there. Sticking to their own judgment is gonna end up getting more people killed.

You were right on everything until you said, "as long as the man arab news agenices only show the civilian deaths." What you should've said was just: "as long as man has free will." It's impossible to kill it. I mean, we mind as well go destroy all corruption in all of the governments in the entire world. But there's no harming in trying.

Then again, if you're really fascist or a really evil communist leader, you can turn people into robots and end all terrorism. Of course, you'll have to shoot any one that asked the wrong questions, or tried to think outside of the box. Only way to battle terrorism is to limit what people can do. And that limit is what we call freedom. And that's one thing worth fighting for.

1 major thing I want to point out. The government knows why osama hates us. I mean, they're the government. They KNOW things like this. Then why the hell did our president say that they hate us for our freedom? We know that's not the answer. That's just too stupid of an answer. They wouldn't hate us, they would love us. (Unless they're right wing fascists, but that's a different scenario) They would move here, and live. Not go over here and plan out an attack.

If you want to know why they attacked us, go watch the video.

And if you're calling the guys in iraq, the suicide bombers there the "Terrorists." Then wtf are the soldiers? They come into a country, and try to occupy the place. Doesn't military know about history? Occupations never last, unless the country there really wants the soldiers there. And trust me, no one really wants us there. So that brings me to final question, WHY THE ARE WE THERE? To battle terrorism? Protect our great nation? Help people with democracy? Governments never help people with out an incentive. They're not noble knights found in fantasy books.

Back on topic:
The best thing to do with religion, is to just wait for it to die out. Through time it'll eventually just become laughed at. And with the internet on the rise, people will become smarter and eventually will start to use a thing called logic and reasoning, and apply it to everything. It'll be a new rebirth of thinking for the masses. When that happens, religion will have to adapt by adding/removing some stuff. Like they always have done.

Its going to be awhile before it dies out, we have been attacked since around the 1970s.

We are in Iraq now becuase if we leave, terrorists will take over the oil fields and then there will be a BIG problem, endless supply of money. Terrorists in Iraq are targeting civilians, I geuss we could be called terrorists too if a civilian accidentally steps into a fire fight....or one of our bombs misses it's target (very rarely).

Terrorists are nothing more than criminals. They're a lot like vigilantes in a way. We're basically the police. To us, they're nothing but criminals. And to them, we are too. And they were out for justice. Yet, we're now out for justice, cause we think they started the fight. An eye for an eye only works if you know who started it and why. And most us here, don't even know who started it, or even why. I'm sure we're smarter than the average american. (Hopefully) If we're having trouble with this, then just imagine how hard the average american is having. Then again, they don't have any trouble. Cause they just don't really care. That's why it's so easy to notice when the government tries to manipulate people. They don't have to try really hard. People never listen to people like me. Instead, they give them a blank stare, or just kill them.

and they fight us becuase they were told they will get 40 virgins when they go to heaven if they die in battle.

That's not the only reason why.

not if they die battle, it's if they kill a non believer. They had lots of countries to choose to attack, yet they chose one of the most powerful. U.S.A. Why didn't they just go over to spain, or Italy? Oh wait, I forgot. They had another reason.

They did go and blow up a metro train in spain when they allied themselves to us.Now Spain is controolled by a Communist party.

Anyways I think America started it in the cold war with its support of dictatorships in the middle east.

You know there are many factions to the Al Queda. They all work independantly of eachother and most of them don't know what the other ones are doing. Just because one goes and blows something up doens't mean they all support it or would go do it themselves (and Spain has had its fair share of other terrorist problems for a long time). But you are right that the US started it during the cold war.

And Chris, who had control of the oil feilds before the war? Oh wait I remember now, the terrorist who the US went in there to take out, so wouldn't it all be the same? (well not exactly but you get what I mean)

Another thing, if they went in to Iraq to fight terrorism why didn't they go into a country where they could have a chance in negotiating with them or actually winning. There are plenty of countries (not all poor or under dictatorship) that have a terrorist problem.

I see your point, if your referring to the terrorists as 'them' then it would be hard to meet with them becuase mmm they don't want to talk to us? PLus any number of things could happen, such as the guy your meeting blows himself up, kidnaps you etc...

I never said its the only reason why they hate us so much, I just want to tell you guys that some major reasons why they hate us is becuase they were told they would get 40 virgins when they go to heaven (I kind of worded it weird in my last post, but you get what Im saying) and for US supporting the formation of Israel.

If you read the whole post you would have understood that I wasn't just talking about Muslim Exteremist groups. And if you would stop repeating the 40 virgins thing that would be great, that isn't the only reason people are blowing themselves up.

Well that was a very sketchy statement, and I don't know if you knew this but America and pretty much every other country does not talk with terrorists (as in making deals and such).

and if you actualy read MY post you would realize I said it wasn't the only one...

Lol, America deals with terrorists all the time. You just don't know it.

ADDITION:
Lol, America deals with terrorists all the time. You just don't know it.

lol, you can say that again, our policy is we don't neogociate with terrorists (or how ever you spell it)

chris he's right... we do negotiate with terrorists. WE put saddam in iraq and gave him weapons. WE trained osama bin ladan and gave them tons of weapons. Why? For them to fight the soviet union. When they won that war, using terrorism and geurilla tactics, they moved onto us. We may have the policy of not negotiating, but we do it anyway. Not sure if you knew that.

Also to further explain that we break our on policies... watergate scandal. I'm pretty sure we had a rule about what nixon did, otherwise it wouldn't have been illegal.

Thats why we are America, we say one thing and do another!