Report, edit, etc...Posted by Syphon on 2006-03-07 at 21:46:49
Vengeful God...
Loving God...
Vengeful God!
Loving God...
Vengeful God!
Loving God!
He's loving now because he can be. WE got better. He gets better with that, being in somethnig image works both ways. IE when everyone was sodomizing themselves and their mothers he got raging. Now the worst we have is BDSM beastialists on drugs. Much better.
Loving God...
Vengeful God!
Loving God...
Vengeful God!
Loving God!
He's loving now because he can be. WE got better. He gets better with that, being in somethnig image works both ways. IE when everyone was sodomizing themselves and their mothers he got raging. Now the worst we have is BDSM beastialists on drugs. Much better.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2006-03-08 at 19:17:09
QUOTE(Ninebreaker @ Mar 5 2006, 01:13 AM)
Both...
God will not forgive you if you deny God's existence when you die.
Otherwise, you can repent and will be forgiven. The people of the Old Testament did not repent until their punisments were recieved.
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God will not forgive you if you deny God's existence when you die.
Otherwise, you can repent and will be forgiven. The people of the Old Testament did not repent until their punisments were recieved.
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If you're God would torture me for using the free choice he, from what I've heard, gave us to use as we wish, then he's an evil illegitimate child in the first place. That's practically Entrapment....
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Demaris on 2006-03-08 at 19:29:16
That's like Saddam hussein saying, you can vote for whoever you want, but if you don't vote for me i'll kill you.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Neiji on 2006-03-08 at 22:21:07
QUOTE
If you're God would torture me for using the free choice he, from what I've heard, gave us to use as we wish, then he's an evil illegitimate child in the first place. That's practically Entrapment....
What part of this is torture?:
-Judgement
-Free Will
-God wanting you to (WANTING YOU) to believe in him
-Hell (Wow, all this is, is separation from God. Your choice. Only person who's "burning" is Satan and his little friends.)
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Do-0dan on 2006-03-08 at 22:29:28
when you go to hell, you also have no moral, so everyone there could be like savage animals or empty shells
now mix that with eternal life and you get: torture, or eternal suffering
now mix that with eternal life and you get: torture, or eternal suffering
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2006-03-08 at 22:53:04
Exactly, so by not beleiving in him, through logical progression and decision of free choice, I am thereby damned to hell.
Now if this simply a place where you are separated from God, then I'm all for that. However, the idea that all the criminals, murderers, rapists, etc. get sent there makes it little more than a jail cell, correct? To keep them from the beleivers, the forgiven, right?
What have I done to deserve to live with them, eh?
Your system is unjust and/or flawed...
Now if this simply a place where you are separated from God, then I'm all for that. However, the idea that all the criminals, murderers, rapists, etc. get sent there makes it little more than a jail cell, correct? To keep them from the beleivers, the forgiven, right?
What have I done to deserve to live with them, eh?
Your system is unjust and/or flawed...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kow on 2006-03-09 at 09:40:36
Criminals, rapist, etc can go to heaven if they are truly sorry for their crime and ask for forgiveness.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2006-03-09 at 17:12:24
I'm pretty sure you understood the point I was trying to make...
The ones that do not want to repent will be stuck with any good-hearted non-beleivers, correct?
The ones that do not want to repent will be stuck with any good-hearted non-beleivers, correct?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kow on 2006-03-09 at 18:23:08
Yes, they will.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by re_casper on 2006-03-09 at 19:31:29
QUOTE(Demaris @ Mar 8 2006, 04:29 PM)
That's like Saddam hussein saying, you can vote for whoever you want, but if you don't vote for me i'll kill you.
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not really... its more like... you were damned in the beginning... and continue to be damned unless you believe in God. That is basically what it is...
More like Saddam Hussein saying, "You will die because you did something very bad against the entire human race, you can vote for me and live, or die."
this is very off topic...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Neiji on 2006-03-09 at 22:14:44
Okay, you CHOOSE to not believe in God. He doens't damn you. You choose for urself. And then, in hell, you do not have bodies, there fore no nerves, no pain. People think that you can actually have ur brain and take it up to heaven/down to hell. No. You just "exist" like in a dream-like state but heaven - happiness and hell - no happiness. Happiness is being w/ God. That's what I believe, u can say it's stupid or wutever, but it's my opinion.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Shapechanger on 2006-03-09 at 23:10:05
I still say I should get off on Entrapment and go to HeavenReport, edit, etc...Posted by MillenniumArmy on 2006-03-09 at 23:53:55
QUOTE(Castaminator @ Mar 9 2006, 09:14 PM)
Okay, you CHOOSE to not believe in God. He doens't damn you. You choose for urself. And then, in hell, you do not have bodies, there fore no nerves, no pain. People think that you can actually have ur brain and take it up to heaven/down to hell. No. You just "exist" like in a dream-like state but heaven - happiness and hell - no happiness. Happiness is being w/ God. That's what I believe, u can say it's stupid or wutever, but it's my opinion.
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I think Hell is a place eternal suffering. Not sure if that means pain or anything, but whatever it is, it's something I would definately not want to go to.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Loser_Musician on 2006-03-10 at 18:54:36
QUOTE(Castaminator @ Mar 9 2006, 10:14 PM)
Okay, you CHOOSE to not believe in God. He doens't damn you. You choose for urself. And then, in hell, you do not have bodies, there fore no nerves, no pain. People think that you can actually have ur brain and take it up to heaven/down to hell. No. You just "exist" like in a dream-like state but heaven - happiness and hell - no happiness. Happiness is being w/ God. That's what I believe, u can say it's stupid or wutever, but it's my opinion.
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the whole premise of you not believing there is a god makes you go to hell is such an inaccurate system of seperating the good from the bad, it's seriously laughable.
If george bush didn't show himself, kept his entire life so secretive a lot of people didn't even think he even existed. Do you think it would be just to throw those people into prison for the rest of their lives? Do you get the main idea?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Neiji on 2006-03-11 at 00:04:05
QUOTE
If george bush didn't show himself, kept his entire life so secretive a lot of people didn't even think he even existed. Do you think it would be just to throw those people into prison for the rest of their lives? Do you get the main idea?
Yeah, I get ur main idea. But it's the same thing as criminals condemning the US government's laws cuz THEY don't liek the way it is. The law is just and right, but there will always be people who don't see it that way.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by MindArchon on 2006-03-11 at 02:25:36
One thing you have to realize is that the bible was written by people. Even if you do or don't believe in god, THE BIBLE WAS WRITTEN BY PEOPLE. Sure, maybe "god" gave the basic laydown, but he didn't personally write it.
What cracks me up is that if you reliably go by everything the bible says, I am positive that 100% of the population will not make it into heaven. Two examples are in my signature that show's god's irrational in the old testament. It makes no sense. Here are some examples. Some of these crack me up, because people would actually believe this stuff.
Do any of these sound like they apply to modern day? Better yet, who actually follows of these rules? They may have applied > 2000 years ago, but now they are just foolish. This makes me think religion is a sham.
Also: Notice how the witness of miracles diminish as science grows.
What cracks me up is that if you reliably go by everything the bible says, I am positive that 100% of the population will not make it into heaven. Two examples are in my signature that show's god's irrational in the old testament. It makes no sense. Here are some examples. Some of these crack me up, because people would actually believe this stuff.
QUOTE
Exodus 22:20, anyone who worships any god other than the christian god shall be "destroyed utterly".
In 2 Kings 17:26 God sends lions out to kill people who have never heard of them. Ignorance is not an excuse. So people living in isolated third world countries who have not heard of god are going to hell.
Deuteronomy 20:13-14: When your army takes a city, kill all the men.. oh wait doesnt that violate one of the ten commandments?
Exodus 21:7-10: If your daughter is misbehaving, sell her into slavery
Isaiah 3:16-26/1 Timothy 2:9: Women who are flirting will be stripped naked, made bald, make them ugly, and make them smell bad. Yeah ok, because that makes LOTS of sense.
Ezekiel 23:19-27: Women cannot be engage anyone in sexually activity, only men can engage somebody in sexual contact
1 Corinthians 14:34-35: Women cannot speak in Church. They can only keep quiet and ask for clarifcation from a husband when they return home.
Leviticus 27:1-7: God provides us with dollar values for women and men
Numbers 25:1-4: Anyone who uses a prositute will have their head chopped off.
Jude 1:7: Any non-marital sex will have you sent to hell.
Deuteronomy 22:22: You cannot have sex with anyone else after you are married.
Deuteronomy 23:2: If a child is born when you are not married, the child will be sent to hell, as well as 10 generations of his children.
Leviticus 15:1-15: After a man has an orgasm, he is unclean for seven days. He must wash himself and his clothes in spring water. Then, he must bring either two turtledoves or two pigeons to the nearest church and give them to the priest to atone for his "sin".
Exodus 35:2: If you work on the Sabbath, that is a capital offense. You are going to hell.
Galatians 5:21: If you have ever been drunk, you are going to hell.
In 2 Kings 17:26 God sends lions out to kill people who have never heard of them. Ignorance is not an excuse. So people living in isolated third world countries who have not heard of god are going to hell.
Deuteronomy 20:13-14: When your army takes a city, kill all the men.. oh wait doesnt that violate one of the ten commandments?
Exodus 21:7-10: If your daughter is misbehaving, sell her into slavery
Isaiah 3:16-26/1 Timothy 2:9: Women who are flirting will be stripped naked, made bald, make them ugly, and make them smell bad. Yeah ok, because that makes LOTS of sense.
Ezekiel 23:19-27: Women cannot be engage anyone in sexually activity, only men can engage somebody in sexual contact
1 Corinthians 14:34-35: Women cannot speak in Church. They can only keep quiet and ask for clarifcation from a husband when they return home.
Leviticus 27:1-7: God provides us with dollar values for women and men
Numbers 25:1-4: Anyone who uses a prositute will have their head chopped off.
Jude 1:7: Any non-marital sex will have you sent to hell.
Deuteronomy 22:22: You cannot have sex with anyone else after you are married.
Deuteronomy 23:2: If a child is born when you are not married, the child will be sent to hell, as well as 10 generations of his children.
Leviticus 15:1-15: After a man has an orgasm, he is unclean for seven days. He must wash himself and his clothes in spring water. Then, he must bring either two turtledoves or two pigeons to the nearest church and give them to the priest to atone for his "sin".
Exodus 35:2: If you work on the Sabbath, that is a capital offense. You are going to hell.
Galatians 5:21: If you have ever been drunk, you are going to hell.
Do any of these sound like they apply to modern day? Better yet, who actually follows of these rules? They may have applied > 2000 years ago, but now they are just foolish. This makes me think religion is a sham.
Also: Notice how the witness of miracles diminish as science grows.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Neiji on 2006-03-11 at 10:42:32
Yeah, they were written by people, so all I got from the Bible is the idea of God. The other things like Adam and Eve I refuse to believe...
Yeah, I know miracles are diminishing, but I don't think we NEED miracles because enough people are Christian... *my opinion start laughing*
Yeah, I know miracles are diminishing, but I don't think we NEED miracles because enough people are Christian... *my opinion start laughing*
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2006-03-11 at 16:09:56
Either one of those gods may exist, but chances are, God doesn't give a shiz what happens on Earth.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Zwitch on 2006-03-11 at 19:28:45
MindArchon, I am glad to see someone actually site some biblical references, however most of these are Old Testament passages. Yeah, I do agree with you that some of the Old Testament stuff is kinda weird, but many of these customs, laws, and traditions were abolished under the New Covenant with Jesus in the New Testament (this is actually what led to Jesus being persecuted by the Jews, their Old Testament doctrines conflicting with the practices and laws he set into place). A good example of this is the customary animal sacrifices which were replaced by the body of Christ. It is incorrect to interpret everything in the Old Testament as things that are still in effect (some thing still are). Also, you are correct in saying the Bible was written by people, however, it was written by God through people.
Another thing I noticed is you also misinterpreted some of these passages and/or set them as absolutes even though many of them are not. An example of this is Galatians 5:21 (I'll use this since it's actually New Testament). Let's start from verse 19 since that's actually the beginning of sentence.
"Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, unclenness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, [Verse 21] envy, murders, drukenness, revelries, and all the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God." Galatians 5:19-21 NKJV
The key word in this passage by Paul is "practice" which means a continual, habitual action. A continual practice of these things without repetance will lead to separation from God's kingdom. (Kind of a bit different from "If you have ever been drunk you are going to hell" wouldn't you agree?)
Now that's just one example I looked up, doing every one of these verses would be very difficult due to time and knowledge. I will admit that I probably could not answer all of these but not all questions we may have are answered in the Bible, only the ones we need to know. Part of faith comes from knowing this.
Miracle speaking, miracles aren't as necessary now after Christ's resurrection, quite humorous how some people think its a MUST to see a miracle to believe (see Luke 11:29), and by the way, how did that SCIENCE comparison get in there? I could have stuck in any random concept of exponential growth over time just for senselessness if I wanted to also (humans, technology, microorganisms, inhabited land, etc.). Would this happen to be in reference to the scientific method by any chance?
In response to your signatures, the "for some reason" can be found in Numbers 4:15. Also I suggest you read up on levirate marriages (an Old Testament custom by the way)
Another thing I noticed is you also misinterpreted some of these passages and/or set them as absolutes even though many of them are not. An example of this is Galatians 5:21 (I'll use this since it's actually New Testament). Let's start from verse 19 since that's actually the beginning of sentence.
"Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, unclenness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, [Verse 21] envy, murders, drukenness, revelries, and all the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God." Galatians 5:19-21 NKJV
The key word in this passage by Paul is "practice" which means a continual, habitual action. A continual practice of these things without repetance will lead to separation from God's kingdom. (Kind of a bit different from "If you have ever been drunk you are going to hell" wouldn't you agree?)
Now that's just one example I looked up, doing every one of these verses would be very difficult due to time and knowledge. I will admit that I probably could not answer all of these but not all questions we may have are answered in the Bible, only the ones we need to know. Part of faith comes from knowing this.
Miracle speaking, miracles aren't as necessary now after Christ's resurrection, quite humorous how some people think its a MUST to see a miracle to believe (see Luke 11:29), and by the way, how did that SCIENCE comparison get in there? I could have stuck in any random concept of exponential growth over time just for senselessness if I wanted to also (humans, technology, microorganisms, inhabited land, etc.). Would this happen to be in reference to the scientific method by any chance?
In response to your signatures, the "for some reason" can be found in Numbers 4:15. Also I suggest you read up on levirate marriages (an Old Testament custom by the way)
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snipe on 2006-03-12 at 21:57:25
I'm going with both in one. This is what makes him so remarkable. He is able to punish for the wrong things but to forgive aswell. He is one who will let you Redeam your bad deeds and giving you chances.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Euknemarchon on 2006-03-14 at 15:13:26
Anybody that seems to think that there are two gods in the Bible are wrong. Go read the Book of Matthew. Jesus goes grar too.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kow on 2006-03-14 at 15:18:34
That was totally irrelevant as noone here stated there were more than the one God