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Well for one you wouldn't say that map made by that person is good, just that that map is good . But I get your point.

I've been thinking some more about the system and I think that it is indeed wise to think about those people who will start whining about their map not being made Premium, and crap like that. I think it is very important to [/i]not[/i] make a map premium every... month or whatever. Only, and only when the judges find a map which might be worthing it will be considered to be made Premium. Sometimes two very well made maps come out in the same week, sometimes none of those will be made for weeks.
About the elitists and Thurstday evening things. I still think that a well chosen jury will not be effected to much by elitism or anything like that, simply because I'm rather sure this forum most certainly has people who think for themselfs and do not easily prejudices someone.

And yeah, you'll probably have quite a lot of people who will not agree with the judges and think that there mass zombie map is way better then that realistic RPG. But to be honest I don't really care a lot about those people and (while this might seem a little elitise ) SEN might be better of without them, or at least a couple of them. Also, adding a don't beg rule will certainly help, especially when you actively enforce it.


Btw, thanks for all your comments .

I think this it's a really good theory/concept, but a really bad idea as far as practicality goes. The problem is, a "good" map is soo subjective, you really can't differentiate between "a really good map" and an "excellent map" without involving personal taste. In order to get all the maps that deserve to be there through subjectiveness, there will be a lot of maps that don't deserve to be there, and if you make it so hard that all the maps deserve to be there, there will be a lot that won't make it.

Not to mention that unknown makers or maps will be treated differently than known makers or maps, even if on accident. Which promotes elitism.

well why not just take the maps that are submitted on the week. Find the like top 5 that DLDB have chosen then have a weekly vote which is best.

Of course the problem arises when the keepers run out of maps to judge but in the event that happens then it would be easy to just say

"not enough maps are worthy enough for the premium selection and has been delayed untill the following week"

Then in DLDB add more sections such as;

Action/ Rpg
Bounds
Defense/offense
Click/ Arena
Other

Premium Action/ Rpg
Premium Bounds
Premium Defense/ Offense
Premium Click. Arena
Premium Other

By now you may be thinking

"people will always be going for the premium maps as opposed to the normal ones."

Which in reality is true, but if they were good enough to be classified as premium they deserve to be downloaded and played more.

And the fact that premium won't be as large as the regular ones so eventually they will run out of Premium Choices.

Then maybe after a category has maybe 10 premium maps in it. A "Vote the map out" could occur. In this vote there will be 10 options for each of the maps. The map with the least votes to stay in/ the most votes out will be kicked out and replaced with the new one.

This could also impliment a map ladder system for example;

Premium Bounds Rating Time
1.BlahBlah Bound 8 3 weeks
2.Zig Zag Bound 7 0 weeks
3. Etc Bound... 4 0 weeks

Note: These bound names were picked at random they may or may not exist

For every succesfull week your map is the number 1 "premium category" you can get a bonus.

Isn't this what Map Spotlight is for?

map spotlight is used for maps that win the monthly contest... this is all the maps in the DLDB in general o.o

Instead of using a panel of judges, why not use number of views, number of download, and/or map rating to auto-select premium maps?
That would create a "Premium RPG" category that looked something like this:

QUOTE(Premium RPGs)

Legacy of Hæan
Collective of the Four Elements
World of Starcraft III
Death Knights 3
So It Begins
GTA classic
5th Station
Volc's World Series Pack
Honourless
Omicron RPG
Crystal RPG
Everarcha RPG
Project FATEA
Sorcery RPG
Nightmare RPG
Dungeons and Dragons
World of Starcraft
FF7 World
Final Fantasy III
Majesty RPG

There would need to be a system that can decide how to actually rank the maps, I didn't do it perfectly. =P
Obviously a download or a rating point should be worth more weight than a view, and that sort of thing.
Also, as long as the download/rating system dosen't have some huge gaping maw of an exploit, this type of map selection would be non-bias.

Do you really just think though that by saying "Don't beg for premium blah blah" would acutally work? Hardly anybody reads the rules anyways and most people are too dumb to obey them. People don't take the time to read anything, a good example is when noobs post in the wrong map making forum even though there is a label for the forum (well there are some hard judgements). And it would probably promote elitism like many others have said.

Well, one of my original plans was to just strip everything out of the DLDB for v5 and then start fresh with higher quality controls on what gets approved.

The problem with that is trying to filter out all the good maps that are currently in the DLDB for re-submission.
But, I like that idea, it's hot.
What's the ETA on v5 anyway?

Actually, no. Rexy is right. The Map Spotlight was originally made to showcase excellent maps made by the community each week. It started off as a place to show newly completed maps by some of the better map makers at SEN (Kenoli, Bolt, Tux, to name a few). As time went on, people got lazy and it was updated less frequently.

Now it is mainly used for contests, yes, but that wasn't its original purpose.

I think the map spotlight should go back to its original nature and this set of "Premium Maps" we're talking about should simply be Map Spotlight maps. Rather than labelling them "Premium," you can make a huge list of those exceptional maps that made it to the spotlight in the first place.

If the Spotlight section would be updated more frequently and more time and energy would be put in it then I think that is a great way to implant this idea. You'll keep most of the advantages while having a lot less disadvantages, which is the way to go.

Sounds good to me .

Nice idea. Seems that you put alot of effort into this . Think it overnight? Anyway, you're right. It probably WILL prevent map stealing, but there are the occasional exceptions. Heh, people will just make crappier versions of the goddamn map and brag off of it. Now, I'm a lazy Professional. I quit because I lost my friggin' motivation. But this, does not motivate me in any way. Sorry. There's already a rewarding system. The Contest ect. Also, pretty much, the only thing I think we can benefit from this 'system', that's NOT ALREADY PREVENTED, is the map STEALING thing.

Map stealing isn't even an issue any more.

Or what about a servic charge. It could cost 100 minerals to register a map to the premium list/section. And also it could be free or entitled to regulars and above
but yeah I like that idea because there are good map makers mixed in with others but if you like that suggestion then go ahead.

I also want a place where you can find only good maps. But only way I see how this could be fair in a public vote.

But DAED, if you fear elitism then why would you want a public vote which would allow all the elitists to vote, as well as all those people who played the map for 5 minutes and just (dis)liked the sounds and those people who vote because their friend is in the poll and those people who just like to click buttons and and and...

Not ment as a flame but to be honest I do not think that serious people who will actually play the map completely and have a good thought about it are in the majority. Do you think they are?
I think not. That is why I suggest selecting those people who do[i/] judge as one should and let [i]them decide which map is the best considering the many factors as story line, originality, etc.

I see a third option though, a combination of both. You could let the jury pick out three good maps (whenever they see three good ones) and let the rest decide which of those three is the best. Or vica versa, you let the general public pick out a couple of good maps and let the jury decide which of those is the best. The first is a lot better then the latter though, I my opinion, not only because it is way more practical

Currently I see four possiblities:
1) Have a carefully selected jury promote a map the Premium Map status
2) Give the Spotlight section a boost and use that instead of a Premium Map section
3) Let the jury pick out a couple of good maps, the public will decide which of those deserve Premium Map status.
4) The public decides which map gets Premium Map status

Maybe something along the lines of... some map gets nominated for "Premium Status" five times... then the judges vote on whether or not it gets in?

Yeah that sounds good to me, but how does a map get 'nominated'?

I think that the best solution would indeed be a combination of both public and jury voting, that way you hopefully get the pro's of both and block out most of the con's.

Ok, if you don't want the public to choose maps. Let the public to choose/vote the judges. Noob & elitism problems solved.

Yeah I was about to suggest that. Rather than trusting the public to vote on the maps, why not have elected judges that would vote on the "Premium Maps." That way its representational. People can nominate members (perhaps these nominees have to be "Regulars" or better) and then a giant vote can take place on whether or not they should become the judges.

The main issue with this is that it becomes a popularity contest. To counter that, perhaps the nominees have to be approved by the administration (or some sort of group with power). Its still a popularity contest per se, but the administration is then forced to be as fair as possible.

So the public can vote on nominees, which have to be approved by the administration, for the elected judges which will vote which maps will get premium status... but who is going to check the administration which checks the nominees who checks the maps?

Lets not make it over complicated. You will always have problems like elitism and prejudices, the only things which really matter are how strong they are, how much effect they have.
In my opinion that 'uber evil' effect is the stronger in a random group then a carefully selected group, which sounds rather logic doesn't it?

No one will check the administration. And no one will have to. It will be obvious if they choose people they like as a nominees. That would look bad for the admins.

I think we need judges to select maps, no matter how you look at it. Leaving it to a public vote is dangerous and leaving it to one person is considered "elitist."

Or how about this. Every week we have a global vote for selected maps of regulars and above or regulars and above get free entry but members pay 100 minerals so then whichever map gets the most vote is put in the premiuem selection.

Or it costs 300 minerals to submit a map to the premium selection. If its agreed it gets the royal treatment, but if denied the person loses there minerals and the minerals get shared out to the regulars and elites

Hm, no. Not only regulars should be able to get their map promoted to Premium Status. It doesn't matter who made the map, only the map itself. By adding a miniral cost you will reduce the amount of people who think every map of them will get Premium Status, however it should not be (that) much.

What are you talking about. Public vote judges, the rest is up to them.

But actually, it does not matter how much we dabate it here. Because no-one will ever start any new feature on v4. They'll just say "wait till v5" or something...