Staredit Network

Yup, restriction programs are illegal. OSMAP is a way to stop illegal map restriction. Thanks for shining the spotlight on how map restriction isn't just immoral, but also illegal!

*sigh* It seems nobody is going to convince you that OSMAP wasn't the right thing to do, but I'll try one last time to get through your thick skull. IF IT WAS ILLEGAL, BLIZZARD WOULD HAVE STOPPED IT!!! There is this thing called a law suit. They work. And as for being immoral... is it wrong to stop your own creations from being stolen by somebody else?

"A. Subject to the Grant of License hereinabove, you may not, in whole or in part, copy, photocopy, reproduce, translate, reverse engineer, derive source code, modify, disassemble, decompile, create derivative works based on the Program, or remove any proprietary notices or labels on the Program without the prior consent, in writing, of Blizzard.


Copyright © 1997 Blizzard Entertainment. All Rights Reserved."


i dunno, but wouldn't you agree that Xtra editor is in violation(derivative). it is created from staredit isn't it? i also have a hunch that SF and SCMD2 may be on the line of being counted as devrivative works.

If that's the case, then OSMAP is as illegal as protection. That would also probably mean all mods are illegal too. And EUD's.

modern map making would absolutely cease to exist. believe me, a little protection is worth all the advacned things we get.

It's illegal, but Blizzard doesn't care that much. This sort of thing happens all the time. Take a look at Penguin Plug: It used to be illegal but is now considered a necessary evil because it is required to play on WGT, a ladder on Europe. This sort of thing could happen with OSMAP.



They're not yours. They're Blizzard's. Also, if map restriction is so great, why didn't Blizzard make it a part of all StarCraft maps from version 1.0? Obviously, they don't care about what you perceive to be rights.

lmfao, okay then, if its blizzards, do you have the right to modify it AGAIN by unprotecting it? not only modifing it, but reproducing it in an unoriginal state.

Returning a map to it's natural state is a good thing.

maybe cause Starcraft was being rushed at that point? hell, they didn't even check to make sure all the trigger conditions in Staredit work properly, i think it was Tux who found some inconsistencies with bring and command conditions(or some other problem along these lines).

Or maybe they chose to let the community decide by itself. to see if map stealers/riggers would develop and how map makers would react to this.

That's the thing though, OSMAP usually can't revert a map to it's "natural" state, only the approximation that's left after it's been protected.

Thats because map protectors rape the hell out of maps.


You can rename things you know...


Do you not even acknowledge the other unprotection sides arguments? Your post doesn't even contribute to the argument at all.


Why would Blizzard waste their time on a matter like this? Protection/unprotection doesn't even matter to them and it does nothing to harm the community which is why Penguinplug is allowed.


It states in the EULA that Blizzard owns all .scx and .scm files. The subject is just not important enough for Blizzard to step in and disallow protection. Here is where it sais that Blizzard owns everything.

The legal issues are moot. They don't pursue them. They could, but they don't. It's just to cover their ass if a 3rd party program came about that did them some harm, where they'd be able to blam it legally. Or if there's a profit making opportunity with someone's works that they want a part of, if they were desperate enough. Typical corporate stuff.

As for Penguin Plug, I can only assume they got legal permission in writing if it's become official (like mentioned in the EULA). That, or they just don't give a rat's ass.

The fact is, All your .scm and .scx are belong to Blizzard. You are not allowed to use third party programs to tamper with them and restrict them from the public. OSMAP reverses the illegal map restriction. Therefore, OSMAP is good. If you disagree, you are wrong.

Uhhh... despite the fact that OSMAP is a 3rd party program?

Yeah, let's all use the original Staredit. I'm actually fine with that if everyone else does that.

OSMAP is just as illegal. Including the use thereof. Blizzard likely respects protection on principle, so if anything it's OSMAP that's in their disfavor. They just don't care enough to make an issue about it (like most other 3rd party stuff).

Okay, so if OSMAP is illegal, then it should be removed. But wait, that means you can't use map restriction since it's also illegal! I win.

...and while your at it, why not remove SCXE, Starforge, Proedit, SCMDraft, WinMPQ, etc. and every single map or product created or modified with those. After all, they're all just as "illegal" as well.


A real gem of an idea!

If maps are going to be unprotected, it is only logical not to protect them in the first place.



You fail to view my point. I am not in favor of either program, or against it, but a look at all logic behind this had to be taken upon. SeN is a mapmaking website, which policies and intent is to help people create maps, not protect them or unprotect them.

Having both programs in the DLDB would mean that we are a source to all mapmaking things related, not having them means that we are a mapmaking site. As you've mentioned, people will go out of this site to find it. What does SeN have to do with that? I don't know about other people, but while I was GM, I actually did have a non-virus version of OSMAP, and I did open a few maps. What did the SeN rules do to stop me?

Anybody with the knowledge that map unprotectors exist, and the intent to use them, will use them.

It is not a moral issue about "protecting" the mapmaker's rights, it is an issue about traditionality vs change.

I ask a question, that if readers are actually interested, will make them really think about the issue, and it's several faces:

If SeN had endorsed Unprotectors and had been against Protectors, what would've happened when LegacyWeapon released Uberation or Clokr_ release ProEdit? What would be happening in this thread? What would your stance be on this issue?

Excellent! Get rid of all the heretic technology! StarEdit is the only editor we need!

If SEN were to endorse only non-protected maps it'd either be making the message that ownership will only come though public recognition (which'd be great for elites, but hurt the newer mappers if their credibility were to come under fire for whatever reason), or else it would mean SEN doesn't value ownership at all, and that maps should be posted as community property only. The latter case may sound good and all, but realize a lot of people want to be associated with their maps, like if they have a goal in mind through making them or else just want the rep. Rep may sound selfish, but if they're making maps in the first place, the least they could get for their reward is rep.

Hate to break it to you, but the majority of the serious mappers are inspired mainly by ego; whether that's a good thing or not. People won't normally invest the amount of time and energy needed to produce quality maps if not for having some strong driving force, and ego is usually it.


Without recognition, you void ego. And as ideal as they may sound, it also voids the bulk of productivity.





EDIT- If you want to solve the issue of ego, you do it by addressing people's 'need' for it (if there's even a reason to do that). You don't do it by putting it under attack, unless you mean to crush it outright (and thus void it).

I already said that. And I was being serious. I will gladly submit to this so called "open source" if we get rid of all 3rd party programs.

I wouldn't. And I'm pretty sure most mappers wouldn't either.

You'd be killing extended terrain, reinforcing unneeded staredit-specific limits (no units not of player's race placeable?!), skimming a great majority of the 'extra' trigger abilities and discoveries throughout time (some critical to certain game modes' functionality), and rendering the majority of existing maps uneditable without reducing them to Staredit's level. Plus you'd be reverting to inferior tools.



That'd pretty much be the killing blow to what's left of the UMS community as we know it.

it just shows what a stupid argument 'its against the license' is.

Tux, that's my point as well.

I see. This place is corrupted by greed. Luckily, there is a way to stop fearful idiots from restricting learning and that is OSMAP. I think I should take it upon myself to liberate every map I come across for the greater good of this community.