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Everything's an ad hoc cheeze; there are just ones that are right and which ones that are not. You of all people should know that science and reason is the "experimental philosophy".

But that is where you are wrong! *gasp*

It is not an ad hoc once evidence is present. I can see that you're becoming frustrated with these "fallacies".

See, the thing is, you lack the ability to reproduce results that you are supposedly guaranteeing. Also lack evidence to events happening (espcially the really crazy ones in the bible!). While that is probably irrelevant to this situation, the first part is not.

Sure it does.

I thought Kirby was atheist...

Religion is faith i highly doubt some group of ppl decided u know wut would be funny if we wrote this giant book about beliefs and make it into the best seller of all time

Yea, I highly doubt millions of people who have believed in God for thousands of years could be wrong either

You lack the ability to reproduce results as well. Proving something is or isn't are equally important. Being sarcastic and lashing out to prove discontinued points, are lowly things. In my opinion, your P.O.V. is similar to that of which we know as the evil of Hitler. I see this whole thread is upsetting you so I won't go to great lengths to use such words as "Fallacies". By the way, it was an opinion, no matter how deep you take it, opinions arn't wrong, it's just the way we say we don't like em.


No one said anything about you not having arguments, cuz there arn't any. Kirby's point of his post was to clear the face of the hole, "God damns you to Hell" thing. But if you're looking for an argument, the simplest one would be answering my question(which you all have avoided ), it's on the last page, until you answer that you're still at the short end of the stick.

Before you say:

Read that:

And for spam reasons, you said:

When in reality he was clarifying a question. None said anything about an argument or you being an idiot, don't think so much of what people might think .


The Banana-Mobile!

Rare, so rare it hurts . But I agree 100%.

ya ppl actually believed in that stuff and decided that ppl following us should follow wut we believe

As you notice i never said the bible is perfect and should be taken word for word it has been translated many times over for example in latin walked on the water is almost identical to wlaked on the water but it is highly unlikely that there is absolutly no fact in at least the Hebrew scriptures/old testament/pentateche to believe that it is all fake is unfathomable

Kirby hasn't confirmed that, and it's not just "background" information, look at the end of Kirby's post, it has some answers there too.

Thus, proving the uselessness of this thread. It's not that I don't like opinions, it's that I don't like opinions when it's backed by pure faith.

as stated in the first post u cant prove or disprove the existance of god

Not to point out that you're avoiding my question again or anything butthat's just because you don't believe in the fabrication, or existance, of faith. Thus is why you feel this thread is useless, I don't thinkit's useless, everyone gets to discuss their beliefs and reasons for it, it's good use for research, don't close a thread because you can't win(or lose).
And also, you may not like opinions based by faith, but no one likes opinions manipulated by hatred, repentence, or disapproval.

Tdnfthe1, I think this topic is useless. The uses you think this topic is good for is actual off topic material, which should actually be discussed in a different topic, maybe you could make it? This is mostly discussing whether god exists or not, which is useless.

lets be honest here nething on here is useless because discussing it does not change a thing

Exactly! That's why it's useless!

No change = useless.
Discussing on something important = sharing ideas, which is good; discussing ideas that have been talked about over and over and over = useless.

the things we have posted in this forum should make people think before they discus, but they don't

What i meant was nothing said on this site that is not starcraft related is useless because nothing changes

Yes, and by here, it means this topic.

You really hate him don't you?

True, TO AN EXTENT. Take for example this:

No Change is useless?
Explain to me then, why someone started this thread(athiest) and why the argument and attempt of baring proof is being put on the believers(put on by athiests). Obviously someone was trying to make MINDS change through this thread/topic. But to the 100% true point(meaning what I said can be wrong), this thread has been used to enlighten others on the differences in beliefs. People who read this, who knew nothing before, now know something. To point out previous threads, some people learned differences between agnostics and athiests. Some people learn about biblical things. Some people learn of the arguments against/with different religous gods. This isn't pointless, because it enlightens the MINDS. We have both sides of the argument which I think teaches other people who didn't know, both sides instead of one. In my eyes that is the problem with the whole athiest/holy faith thing. Too many people born around God, or born around people who hate god. When you get people who know of both and then choose without a particular grudge against the other side, then you have what I feel is an intelligent individual. However my point stands, don't close the thread out of something as pointless as inconclusiveness. Anything that is inconclusive is discussed, even in politics, they eventually discuss it for years. If you feel this is not worth your time because you can't prove your point, that's your choice no matter how odd it sounds. However do know that this topic has done more good than bad, only when people don't pick on the ones who make sudden posts without thinking, and it is defenitely a worthwhile discussion. Discussions don't need conclusions. If everyone ended discussions that people felt had no conclusion or answer, we wouldn't have the america we have today(Mexico would be a part of europe too). But these are of course my thoughts, not some sort of rule or anything. So let it be what it is.


Is it too serious for this forum? I don't think so, it's too serious for the individuals who get emotional about it, which would be the ones who look below at others for their pety thoughts . Besides that it's not too serious. And why argue with people(believers) if they are "asking for it"? What are you going to do? Prove God non-existant? If it angers you that much, please answer my question from earlier because none has.

But to sum it up, if you feel discussions(not arguments) require a solution just know you need to think ahead of what there is to gain or lose from every confrontation(that's what this has become).

~Tdnfthe1

I tried replying to this piece by piece, but as I did I felt it was a waste of time. So I'll reply to it as a whole and to the quote you were referring to.

Paragraphs is THX.

I'll put my view on what CheeZe said:



No change is useless, period. Anything you've said above saying why people gain from no change is not infact "no change" it is change, which by the way has not happened, as you have been making claims without evidence, and just saying what you believe, and not giving any objective evidence. Also you refer to other topics to prove that this topic should stay. Other topics don't matter.

Infact, the fact that there ARE other topics like this, and it has been discussed over and over and over makes this topic useless. If the same things are being discussed, people should just read the old topics, instead of causing new arguments and creating new flames, which ultimately lead to some kind of "enlightenment". The same "enlightenment" could be accomplished through reading the old topics that have been discussing this same topic.


Basically I feel that the post you quoted has little to do with your reply. You haven't addressed why discussing topics that have been talked about over and over is beneficial as opposed to just reading other topics. This may be an important topic, but it has been talked about before. I'll put it this way

Since you oppose CheeZe then how is


Good?

It IS a waste of time restating your opinion over and over when it has been done in other topics. Especially since the SAME people have the SAME views and create the SAME arguments and never learn. If you keep this topic open I guarantee if you get another 40 page long god topic it will have MANY of the same arguments that were in the last 40 page long topic, with all the people arguing not learning ANYTHING, and still being stubborn with their closeminded views.


ADDITION:
Tdnfthe1, I'm sorry but I must criticize your way of making comments. I just think you ramble way too much without making too many clear points. Being concise is a much better way to get a point across.

Your organization also makes it worse, which ties into the rambling. It's really clear when halfway through I see a transitional word such as however, right in the middle with no new paragraph or anything, especially when you are shifting to another issue or making a different point.

When I last visited this thread, there were only two pages


I dont think these topics are useless.
I have learned alot from these religious threads. I know much more about the atheists/agnostics PoVs and ideas more than I did before

*SIGHS*

Ok, I read that. But I know what the situation is. See, Tdnfthe1 is a "newbie" at this whole god thing.

He hasn't seen the more sophistcated topics on this. And if he did, he certainly hasn't been paying attention to them. The reason I say this thread is pointless is I've discussed this thing more times than you can count.

The last time this happened, the thread was ignored. I destroyed it. I explained every counter arguement to my arguement. I backed it up with evidence. I explained it with reasoning. I showed some counter-counter arguements. You know what people did?

They continued to post the same stuff after. We stopped. The people who understood, stopped. They already knew who was the victor. Of course, the only person who has admitted "defeat" is MilliniumArmy, but he called it a draw. I gladly accepted this since it is pointless.

Try searching past threads on this topic. I assure you, you will see the same arguements on both sides. The only change is evidence. And even then, it's only changed slightly; so slight that the original counter arguement can still probably beat it. You know what this means? Pointless arguing.

Mill you are referring to "these" topics as a hole. Talk about THIS particular topic, that would be thx.