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Naw I just had to put you in your place.





Funny huh?





Nice thought, but no I didn't lie and no I didn't get owned. You really proved my point as well there. I said:


What you said proves nothing or counters anything about what I said. Read more closely.



Out of context? Lol, that's like me asking why don't you try making a UMS map, maybe because you know if you actually tried you would find it to be equally as hard to make as a melee map? Yes it would.



It's better than me having to repeat myself, because you are ignorant
And eventually I do respond, but unlike you, your ignorance never goes away.



I already answered that, and you haven't done your part.

Secondly, GJ! You are still comparing UMS to actual programming, what a fool. I wasn't comparing the control you have over UMS to programming you idiot, I was comparing to melee. And really, UMS is more of creating your own game than melee is, so your point is now void.



Lol, hmm maybe I should have said that in the first place, ok then substitute that with what I said, then answer the question too.



Modified equation, Arrogance + Ignorance + Hypocrisy = ihatett

Btw all your arguments aren't furthering your point at all.

OK, I can get some rest. He isn't even coherent anymore.

That post was so incoherent and ignores so badly what I had said that I still couldn't think of a way to respond to it point-by-point after four or five tries.

I suggest readers of this thread refer my previous post (at the very bottom of page 8) to see what I am talking about. None of my points were actually addressed, and if you look at my post and then his (if in FireFox use a second tab) then you will understand how juvenile and (I hate to repeat the word) incoherent he is being. It makes even less sense if you have been following the thread, as you will catch his past contradictions.

See you guys later, I have Rose.of.Dream to compete with.

[center]ihatett. i agree with devilsk in saying that you know nothing about UMS map making becaus of your arguements stating its just kiddie-programming and kiddie-design. Triggers are kiddie programming, but UMS is certainly not kiddie design. Its a different type of design than melee, sure. I'm not talkig about conceptual maps or bounds or evolves/madness/defense. The area of UMS that I think shows the best UMS map skills arehigh-quality RPGS like qPirateking'sLegacy of Haen. Most rpgs and other single/party focused UMS games utilize lots of very advanced terrain skill. (You can see it in the Terrain Forum) Doodads, buildings, and units must also be placed in an appealing fashion, as well as managing balance issues. What is balance in UMS? Balance is making sure either a. All players are equal or roughly equal or b. the game fits a plnned difficulty curve.
And triggers need people to be inventive, and experiment, just like using sprites and other weird things. The limits of Starcraft can also forsce people to be creative and inventive.



In short, UMS is not just kiddy-design/programming.
Have you ever made a high-quality UMS map? Oh, I didn't think so.[/center]

Like I said before, I am not going to argue with what you said, only clarify that by "design" I meant "game-design", not "low-money map design".

Lol you can't compare UMS design and Melee map design, because most of the time they try to accomplish different goals -.-



Yes, don't argue with him. He is agreeing with me.

Though you quoted the first half of my one-sentence-long post, you missed the second half of it. I was correcting shotgun that by "design" I meant "game design", as in designing games, and not "designing of low-money maps".

Here is the post again:



Now that everything is cleared up, theres no reason for me to come back here. I won this a long ways back.

yep that was flamin, i understand it was random rage. im sorry.

wow...

its Devilesk. vs. Ihatett

Go Ihatett!

I actually read Ihatett's long ass posts, because I at least see something new every time. No point in reading Devilesk's long ass posts, i already know exactly what he's going to say.

And Dr-shotgun, hell, if i was ihatett, i wouldnt want to argue with you either, hell, he's already got an arguemnt going with dev.

"shut you ugly face and go back to your melee mapping while i go back to UMS"

Well... that's childish and ignorant... he IS melee mapping and in the MELEE thread...

And... i like ums and melee, and i think they are both equal in difficulty to create... and from what i've seen Ihatett is a terrific mapmaker

Exactly.

This is more flame-related than melee. If you're just going to flame the crap out of each other, I'm just going to lock this topic. All this is a goddamn quote war fighting for who knows what. Whatever it was it got lost in the novels upon novels you're writing. I was going to actually read this orgy of text, but I can tell from the first seven pages I did read it isn't worth the 10+ minutes it can take. If I can resist from flaming the crap out of Devilesk. (I REALLY want to), so can you.

In short, stop flaming or I'm locking this topic.

Ihatett, you say how programming is tedious yet fun. There is not much difficulty. The same can be said of a UMS mapper who knows what he is doing. How, then, is melee different? Changing a mineral field here, raising a cliff, pushing some water around, it isn't much different. I don't think the map types really have much of a difficulty factor that can be spoken of, only the amounts of time a map can take.

Stop yelling.

Im not, im just making my words big so people can read them.

Wesmic flames the most while contributing the least in this topic.



He is credible, but I never said UMS was harder than programming, I said that a long time ago.



I never kicked him in the nuts. I also use logic as well, but in response to his illogical crap especially when you say "he doesn't spend time on UMS" which basically makes him not credible at all.



No wonder you have no idea what is going on.


I don't see why you take ihatett's side if you say that both are equally hard to make, do you not understand what he is arguing about? Rofl.

as if we couldn't read them otherwise...you are like the red guy

Lol you probably couldn't read it otherwise
That's why he made it huge.

Seriously, Devilesk., what is with you and pointing fingers and alliance systems? EVERY time you argue with someone its "I didn't start it". He takes Ihatett's side? Complimenting a map he's made is NOT taking his side.

... I wasn't responding to that if you read the thing I quoted above.





He said he likes both ums and melee and says they are both EQUAL in difficulty, ihatett is obviously arguing that Melee is harder to make than UMS.

Before he said he was obviously taking his side, since most of his flame posts were directed towards me.



So, you are saying he's flaming me, yet shares the same views with me, meanwhile ignoring everything I say and only taking the time to read ihatett's side? Makes him even more of an idiot then.



Nothing is with me. What the hell are you talking about? Wesmic is being an idiot and contradicting himself in every post, and I can't tell which side he is on. Oh so I'm supposed to try to argue against someone I don't know their position on?



Lol? Not really, there's more too it that you missed. But it's probably because you weren't here since the beginning and don't fully understand what is going on. You also jump to assumptions when saying "everytime". Last time I checked it was ihatett who wanted to push the argument that UMS is harder than Melee, all I ever did was counter it.

Wesmic also tries to be an idiot and blame me for everything here, in fact in one of his posts he basically described ihatett when referring to me. He doesn't know what the hell he's talking about and contributes nothing.

ihatett keeps bringing up the same points. In a nutshell, this is the arguement.

devilesk: You can't argue whenether melee or UMS is harder to make then each other.

ihatett: Yes you can.

devilesk: how?

ihatett: Since UMS is just basically watered-down programming

devilesk: So, UMS has more restrictions making doing an eaiser task more tedious, have you even made an UMS map?

ihatett: I program, so I can eaisly make a UMS map.

devilesk: have you even made a UMS map?

ihatett: I program, which is basically more advanced UMSing.

devilesk: so you haven't?

ihatett: I program, so I can probably make one. UMS is just time-consuming and tedious.

devilesk: So is melee.

ihatett: WHAT?!!! IMPOSSIBLE!!! SO MANY THINGS TO COMPENSTATE FOR IN MELEE, PLACING MINERALS, GAMEPLAY ADVANTAGES!!!!

devilesk: Just as with UMS, you learn tricks that make it eaiser.

ihatett: I obviously program, so I know UMS is eaiser. Bounds are crap.

devilesk: So are money maps.

ihatett: impossible, money maps aren't melee.

devilesk: then bounds aren't UMS

ihatett: No, they are. but money maps isn't melee.

devilesk: They're both played in their respective modes, so why isn't money map melee?

ihatett: since it's doesn't count. programming is advanced umsing.

Lol, nice. But does it really delineate what they were really talking about?

Most if it's true, especially the programming parts I missed some of the arguement, but that's what basically they were saying for a couple of pages.

EDITL: You know what, I'm not even going to respond. I don't want to be drawn back into this.

First of all, what is this thread title?
IS THERE A WAY TO POPULARIZE MELEE?
(not the exact wording but…)

My only suggestion is don’t slap big stuff right on, but start with several small things, like make one uber good melee map. Keep making them. If you are willing to give out SEN minerals, then host competitions in who can make the best melee maps. Also, don’t go saying like “YOU SUCK AT MELEE” or anything, and instead help and encourage people, so that they can make so true melee maps.
Currently, your not helping yourself, attacking other people. Not that you’re the only one, but you should help yourself. Now, get back on topic or delete this thread I say, because it’s going the totally unintended direction as it was meant to..

i didn't bother to read everything. because im sick right now, but people seem to be missing another point.

Can UMS hold money compitions?

no. in BIG melee compitions, the most balanced maps, are made by the best (i think) mappers around. al of yall, i dare you to go and make a melee map and we'll see how popular it gets. most of you, will be just like omg that soooo easy and go try it. then they try to spread it around. it goes nowhere. then they say, i didn't try.

(if alot of things dont make much sense, or if i didn't finish a thought. please excuse me, im really sick..)

Lol, how bout someone also tries to make UMS map that can hold a money competition, oh wait, it would be too hard to do that wouldn't it? Also, popularity doesn't necessarily mean how hard it is to make a map.