Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rhiom on 2005-02-20 at 04:55:23
couldnt u concivably rig a melee map for protoss if you added in some 9999 units in the background for player 12? then the protoss player could control the units and reek havic.... would this work?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-02-20 at 07:05:18
Nope, wont work at all. Melee only uses default unit settings and default triggers to execute a melee game. Melee, only accepts the resources and start locations on the map. UMS and Melee are wide apart in difference. So you couldnt have say a 9999 Fenix Zealot and get a Dark Archon to Mind Control it because the unit wouldnt be there. 
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheOddAngel on 2005-02-20 at 08:19:12
You can rigg a map for terran easy though...
just have minerals on a cliff at all start locations so terran can lift off and go there... thats about the only race that you can rigg easyily
just have minerals on a cliff at all start locations so terran can lift off and go there... thats about the only race that you can rigg easyily
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Yenku on 2005-02-20 at 08:44:33
the thing is, why woulf you want to rig a map, the point of making a melee map, is to balance it for all races. So then everyone can play with the same advantages/disadvanges. For example, small choke points(entrances to your base) are easy to defend with terran and zerg but not toss. because terran have tanks, and zerg have lurkers which both do splash. Toss just have cannons, so they wouldnt be able to fir many
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Puni(F) on 2005-02-20 at 10:02:06
All races have a good chance at getting up there and getting the minerals...Terran can lift off to get up there...Protoss can recall a probe up there...And zerg can transport a drone up there.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CheeZe on 2005-02-20 at 10:38:06
QUOTE(Peazel @ Feb 20 2005, 07:05 AM)
Nope, wont work at all. Melee only uses default unit settings and default triggers to execute a melee game. Melee, only accepts the resources and start locations on the map. UMS and Melee are wide apart in difference. So you couldnt have say a 9999 Fenix Zealot and get a Dark Archon to Mind Control it because the unit wouldnt be there.
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Er, actually, p12 units will appear, even if it's a unit. I dont' know if I should have said that :/
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-02-20 at 10:50:16
QUOTE(CheeZe @ Feb 20 2005, 10:38 AM)
Er, actually, p12 units will appear, even if it's a unit. I dont' know if I should have said that :/
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Really? so assuming you made a melee map and........wait a second.... Resources are player 12 units...woops so your right.
There is another way to seriously rig up one player and totally have the second player short on resources....but its so sad why would you want to do it?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Yenku on 2005-02-20 at 10:54:01
puni, terran can get up there right away, it takes a long time to get upgraded overlords and arbiters compared to a cc
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rhiom on 2005-02-20 at 17:57:06
so you couldnt make the hero 9999, but you could still add heros which only the protoss players could acess... i suppose zerg could parastie em... lol
Report, edit, etc...Posted by SA_Max71 on 2005-02-20 at 19:07:37
QUOTE(Peazel @ Feb 20 2005, 04:05 AM)
Nope, wont work at all. Melee only uses default unit settings and default triggers to execute a melee game. Melee, only accepts the resources and start locations on the map. UMS and Melee are wide apart in difference. So you couldnt have say a 9999 Fenix Zealot and get a Dark Archon to Mind Control it because the unit wouldnt be there.
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What about the terrian? Hmmm? (I know the answer.)
QUOTE(Yenku @ Feb 20 2005, 05:44 AM)
the thing is, why woulf you want to rig a map, the point of making a melee map, is to balance it for all races. So then everyone can play with the same advantages/disadvanges. For example, small choke points(entrances to your base) are easy to defend with terran and zerg but not toss. because terran have tanks, and zerg have lurkers which both do splash. Toss just have cannons, so they wouldnt be able to fir many
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Actually, revears and archons together can do a lot of damage. Although the reaver's needs to be close to a unit to attack it, the sarab can go a LOT further than the tank's attack can.
QUOTE
Furthermore, Terran have only 3 units that can do splash damage (the tank, firebat, and valkery). The zerg have 3 units that can do splash damage (lurker, mutalisk, and devourer). The protoss have 4 units that can do splash damage (archon, revear, corsair, and the high templar's psionic storm).
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-02-20 at 21:22:28
QUOTE
All races have a good chance at getting up there and getting the minerals...Terran can lift off to get up there...Protoss can recall a probe up there...And zerg can transport a drone up there.
If there is no gas on the lower levels, then only Terran can get up there. I played a game where that happened, but the guy sucked, it toomk him over half and hour to wipe me and thos other guy out. Yay for spore colonies and zerglins to counter drops!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by KaboomHahahein on 2005-02-22 at 15:53:04
QUOTE(SA_Max71 @ Feb 20 2005, 07:07 PM)
What about the terrian? Hmmm? (I know the answer.)
Actually, revears and archons together can do a lot of damage. Although the reaver's needs to be close to a unit to attack it, the sarab can go a LOT further than the tank's attack can.
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Actually, revears and archons together can do a lot of damage. Although the reaver's needs to be close to a unit to attack it, the sarab can go a LOT further than the tank's attack can.
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The scarab can follow furthur but if you just tell it to attack a unit, the reaver has to go closer to the unit/building to attack. Sige tank has furthur range.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rhiom on 2005-02-22 at 15:56:52
To get back on topic, you could rig a map for protoss by haveing a player 12 hero somewhere on the map where a protoss dark archon could mind control it. right? .... dont know if you could use this except maybe as a counter balance for a thing that other races get...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-02-22 at 16:59:26
Then WTF would the point be... The only good thing I can see is that the map creator will get flammed majorly. Fine with me.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rhiom on 2005-02-22 at 17:30:20
QUOTE(Chris @ Feb 22 2005, 03:59 PM)
Then WTF would the point be... The only good thing I can see is that the map creator will get flammed majorly. Fine with me.
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well at this monet in time i dont really see a practicle applicartion of this, i was just seeing if it was possible... you know the whole pushing map making to the limit...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheOddAngel on 2005-02-22 at 18:46:19
If you didn't notice I said no minerals beside the start locations only minerals on the cliffs...
Anyway Plain and simple All races exept rterrain would be screwed!!!
Anyway Plain and simple All races exept rterrain would be screwed!!!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-02-22 at 21:23:43
heres the solution to this crappy idea.....
Have a map that doesnt have Random Start Location ticked, then goto player one's start location..........edit the minerals and put in 50000 minerals........then.........at your enemies base.......edit and put like 500 minerals or even something to run out fast but to keep the enemy active.....make sure there are no expansions near his area either......
There, happy?
Have a map that doesnt have Random Start Location ticked, then goto player one's start location..........edit the minerals and put in 50000 minerals........then.........at your enemies base.......edit and put like 500 minerals or even something to run out fast but to keep the enemy active.....make sure there are no expansions near his area either......
There, happy?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by FaZ- on 2005-02-22 at 21:47:26
Not positive because I don't melee much, but I'm pretty sure that melee maps are always played under "Random Start Location"
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Puni(F) on 2005-02-22 at 21:52:24
QUOTE(Peazel @ Feb 22 2005, 08:23 PM)
heres the solution to this crappy idea.....
Have a map that doesnt have Random Start Location ticked, then goto player one's start location..........edit the minerals and put in 50000 minerals........then.........at your enemies base.......edit and put like 500 minerals or even something to run out fast but to keep the enemy active.....make sure there are no expansions near his area either......
There, happy?
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Have a map that doesnt have Random Start Location ticked, then goto player one's start location..........edit the minerals and put in 50000 minerals........then.........at your enemies base.......edit and put like 500 minerals or even something to run out fast but to keep the enemy active.....make sure there are no expansions near his area either......
There, happy?
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You cant unlock the random start location's no matter what you do...It will always be random...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-02-22 at 21:58:30
Yes you can, you can untick it ........make sure you untick all of the forces random start locations. There you have it, ive done it before and ive played on the map over melee
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2005-02-23 at 14:44:43
How to rig a melee map for a given race... sounds like a fun challenge. Well lets see...
Can't think of any good protoss ways though.
- Zerg-
- Place the start location a bit over some terrain with a small path leading up to another seperate set of resources (such that burrow jump would be the only way to get to it). Put unbuildable terrain close to the start location so a terran or protoss player who lifted off or tried to make a building to jump with on their own would not be able to land or build anywhere close to that area.
- Make the base on black tiles that allow creep to cover them, but not any other race's buildings.
- Make the terrain at each race's start locations cut off all of their peons in a small enclosed terrain strip with only enough minerals/gas to research burrow to jump out.
- Anti-zerg: Put a crashable sprite just over an inaccesssible raised terrain patch by a zerg base. The overlords will cast view on it (or a clumsy terran player with liftoff), and cause them to go bye bye by looking there. Put them in places where looking is unavoidable for early base construction to make it at least a handicap to players who know its there.
- Terran-
- Make an adjacent expansion on a cliff with easy liftoff access.
- If the main is on raised terrain, make the cliff edges padded with a mote far enough for siege tanks to hit anything down below, but not the other way around.
- Make paths of raised temple or structure terrain (that can't be built on) that go behind each player's main, then use custom tiles to allow patches on the temple to allow buildings to land.
Can't think of any good protoss ways though.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mune'R0x on 2005-02-23 at 17:21:32
[center]I like the idea of using the crashes. And about the start location thing. You cannot have a melee game with no random start locations. It just wont work. Even if you uncheck all the boxes. Unless you're playing a special TvB bases or whatever. But if you rig the map so like only a certain player gets minerals, or you start off in a trapped area, why do you think the players will stick around 2 minutes before leaving?[/center]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Cnl.Fatso on 2005-02-23 at 19:56:10
You have to make it look balanced without it actually being balanced. Of course, I would not know much about that.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Yenku on 2005-02-23 at 20:05:27
QUOTE(Peazel @ Feb 22 2005, 09:23 PM)
heres the solution to this crappy idea.....
Have a map that doesnt have Random Start Location ticked, then goto player one's start location..........edit the minerals and put in 50000 minerals........then.........at your enemies base.......edit and put like 500 minerals or even something to run out fast but to keep the enemy active.....make sure there are no expansions near his area either......
There, happy?
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Have a map that doesnt have Random Start Location ticked, then goto player one's start location..........edit the minerals and put in 50000 minerals........then.........at your enemies base.......edit and put like 500 minerals or even something to run out fast but to keep the enemy active.....make sure there are no expansions near his area either......
There, happy?
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you cant do that, but you can rig a map for terran, since terran can lift off, they can lift off to a nearby expansion, with gas and like a trillion minerals, and not give the start base any gas, so toss or zerg cannot get there...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2005-02-24 at 16:13:27
I challenge anyone to come up with protoss rigging ideas. I can't think of any lol. Lets see, exploits might be possible with Recall, Stasis, Hallucination, Mind Control, Archon Warping, um, Shuttles? Pylon jumping?
Yeah, protoss is pretty screwed.
Yeah, protoss is pretty screwed.