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Staredit Network -> Serious Discussion -> "Your Property" Is Government Property
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2005-06-25 at 09:19:08
QUOTE
High court OKs personal property seizures
Majority: Local officials know how best to help cities

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Supreme Court on Thursday ruled that local governments may seize people's homes and businesses -- even against their will -- for private economic development.

It was a decision fraught with huge implications for a country with many areas, particularly the rapidly growing urban and suburban areas, facing countervailing pressures of development and property ownership rights.

The 5-4 ruling represented a defeat for some Connecticut residents whose homes are slated for destruction to make room for an office complex. They argued that cities have no right to take their land except for projects with a clear public use, such as roads or schools, or to revitalize blighted areas.

As a result, cities have wide power to bulldoze residences for projects such as shopping malls and hotel complexes to generate tax revenue.

Local officials, not federal judges, know best in deciding whether a development project will benefit the community, justices said.

"The city has carefully formulated an economic development that it believes will provide appreciable benefits to the community, including -- but by no means limited to -- new jobs and increased tax revenue," Justice John Paul Stevens wrote for the majority.

He was joined by Justice Anthony Kennedy, David H. Souter, Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Stephen G. Breyer.

At issue was the scope of the Fifth Amendment, which allows governments to take private property through eminent domain if the land is for "public use."

Susette Kelo and several other homeowners in a working-class neighborhood in New London, Connecticut, filed suit after city officials announced plans to raze their homes for a riverfront hotel, health club and offices.

New London officials countered that the private development plans served a public purpose of boosting economic growth that outweighed the homeowners' property rights, even if the area wasn't blighted.

Justice Sandra Day O'Connor, who has been a key swing vote on many cases before the court, issued a stinging dissent. She argued that cities should not have unlimited authority to uproot families, even if they are provided compensation, simply to accommodate wealthy developers.

The lower courts had been divided on the issue, with many allowing a taking only if it eliminates blight.

"Any property may now be taken for the benefit of another private party, but the fallout from this decision will not be random," O'Connor wrote. "The beneficiaries are likely to be those citizens with disproportionate influence and power in the political process, including large corporations and development firms."

She was joined in her opinion by Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist, as well as Justices Antonin Scalia and Clarence Thomas.

Copyright 2005 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.


Opinions, please? I personally think this is COMPLETE BULLSHIT. My house is MY HOUSE. Not the selectmens'.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by MapUnprotector on 2005-06-25 at 11:11:29
Wow, thats pretty unfair. I'm against clearly stating that ANYTHING that you own can be seized by a private party, that's not fair. It should be done case by case where if the government wants to use your property to build something on it, then they should have to consult with you, and or take it to court just for that case. Anyone who is uprooted should have VERY good compensation.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mini Moose 2707 on 2005-06-25 at 11:28:31
You do realize the Constitution calls for "just compensation" when they do that? Oh wait, no you don't. I still dislike the decision, but it isn't as bad when you throw that important bit in.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheUberPie on 2005-06-25 at 11:28:38
(reading the first four lines and skimming the rest)
I may be no political expert. And correct me if I'm wrong,
but isn't our government set up to oppose kinds of actions,
where the government owns everything?
That they reserve the right to do whatever they want with our property
Sounds like communism to me.

Yes this is crap.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by MapUnprotector on 2005-06-25 at 11:33:39
QUOTE
Justice Sandra Day O'Connor, who has been a key swing vote on many cases before the court, issued a stinging dissent. She argued that cities should not have unlimited authority to uproot families, even if they are provided compensation, simply to accommodate wealthy developers.


What kind of compensation would they get? Like if the government forced my family to move out of my house, what would they give me?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by chuiu on 2005-06-25 at 11:35:02
Monetary, most likely.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by The_Shattered_moose on 2005-06-25 at 14:55:43
I think thats entirly ridiculous, that says that the government can say "company X needs to stimulate the economy more, therefor we can bulldoze your house so company X can build a casino there. Oh, and we just happen to have stock in company X.
The sort of corruption stated above could easily come to pass, as local officials would have the authority to make that statement.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Loser_Musician on 2005-06-25 at 15:02:58
This and the patriot act have basically pissed on the american democracy. And no one has the balls to stand up to it, because most democrats are pussies.

I no longer Love my country now.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Ultimo on 2005-06-25 at 16:27:56
That's why you live in Canada. wink.gif I think it's pretty stupid though.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Loser_Musician on 2005-06-25 at 16:33:09
You saying I live in canada? I live Florida.

Unless you meant that's why I SHOULD live in Canada. Then, that's different.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TheDaddy0420 on 2005-06-26 at 00:01:05
well......sucks for those people.....
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2005-06-26 at 07:48:44
The hell it does suck! The mayor could take force you outta your $250,000 house, offer you $60,000, and then give the house to the mayor's son.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DevliN on 2005-06-26 at 17:33:23
QUOTE(Alpha(MC) @ Jun 25 2005, 01:33 PM)
You saying I live in canada? I live Florida.

Unless you meant that's why I SHOULD live in Canada. Then, that's different.
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He meant that's why you should live in Canada.

Originally when I saw the title of this topic, I thought it was some pro-communist thing. Now that I've read it, I find our government to be a complete failure based on our founding fathers' standards.

UberPie, the Constitution prohibits a lot of things our current government is doing. This wouldn't be the first.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by timmy8586 on 2005-06-27 at 23:38:34
Not saying I'm for it, but if building a place to work could get many jobs for the community, and just displace a few people, don't you think that'd be a good thing to do? Sure, you'd have to move. But that's it. The government buys your house and property, so you're all set to find a nice new house. Hell, I'd bet they'd even overpay for your property for the sole reason of forcing you to move.

Oh no, you have to move! Oh well, get over it. Now many people who once not only leeched welfare from the government but were seen as poor could get jobs. Then the local economy will get more money. Not only will this give a boost to employment but it will lower the tax burden and reduce dependency on the government. Good from both local and national perspective. A little self-sacrifice saves the town.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Felagund on 2005-06-28 at 19:07:55
That's why we all need to elect a Democrat, with intelligence, and... and... fortitude! Do you see what the conservatives are doing? They're destroying our nation! Onward my patriots! Take down the fascist regime!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-06-28 at 20:04:42
As in the words of System of a Down in their new song, B.Y.O.B.

QUOTE(System Of A Down)
You've been feeding lies since, the table cloth...


And another from that song,
QUOTE(System Of A Down)
WHY DON'T THE PRESIDENTS FIGHT THE WARS!!!  WHY DO THEY ALWAYS SEND THE POOR!
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snipe on 2005-06-28 at 20:40:47
I think that Government is Selfish, No matter where you live. I think even though they are we can't Live without them. We live Day by day getting used to everything. See They try and reap in the benfits.. i think its wrong but noone is perfect. This is an oppionion of a 15 year old. I don't really own anything that could be own by Government but i still think its wrong. My oppinion is based of News and etc. But i still stand by it being wrong.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Staredit.Net Essence on 2005-06-29 at 11:14:05
QUOTE(Snipe @ Jun 28 2005, 05:40 PM)
I think that Government is Selfish, No matter where you live. I think even though they are we can't Live without them. We live Day by day getting used to everything. See They try and reap in the benfits.. i think its wrong but noone is perfect. This is an oppionion of a 15 year old. I don't really own anything that could be own by Government but i still think its wrong. My oppinion is based of News and etc. But i still stand by it being wrong.
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Anything you own, can be owned by the government.

If you listen to System Of A Down's song, B.Y.O.B, it tells everything

QUOTE(System Of A Down)
We don't live in a facist nation! Blah blah blah (don't remember that part) You rely on our protection, yet you feed us lies from the tablecloth!


SOAD is very smart when it comes to the corruption of the government.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2005-06-29 at 20:33:54
Anyways, I think it is okay if they can confiscate some properties, but what I do NOT find okay is that they do not offer reasonable amount of cash. They gave a person 60,000 dollars for a 250,000 dollars, and the person had -no choice- but to accept. Thats WAY unreasonable.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by timmy8586 on 2005-06-29 at 21:26:02
QUOTE(Snake)Ling @ Jun 29 2005, 07:33 PM)
Anyways, I think it is okay if they can confiscate some properties, but what I do NOT find okay is that they do not offer reasonable amount of cash. They gave a person 60,000 dollars for a 250,000 dollars, and the person had -no choice- but to accept. Thats WAY unreasonable.
[right][snapback]248591[/snapback][/right]

Mind sharing a link to your source? I'm intrigued.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by The_Shattered_moose on 2005-06-29 at 22:53:06
Timmy, you've obviously never moved, if you had, you would know that its not a "no problem thing", it takes several years to settle into a house and really consider it your home, also, the fact that there is simply no assurance that your property is in fact being confiscated for entirely legitmate reasons. This also brings up what you consider to be a legitimate reason, isn't the government not supposed to get involved in private ventures. Confiscating property to benifit a corporate entity most definitly involves a private entity. This law seems to me like just another way for corrupt persons in the government to profit from creating laws that benifit companies they are affiliated with. Also, why do they have the right to evict you, its your property, not the governments, your property which you purchased with your own money, the government's involvment with it stops at property tax.
Heres an example scenario, John Doe is a government official who'se brother works for XYZ Shoes, he has several hundred shares of stock in XYZ shoes. Now, Mr.Jones lives in a house along a street often traveled, XYZ shoes would profit greatly from opening a store on that street, but there are no houses for sale. If XYZ shoes were to get a store along this street, their stock value would likly skyrocket. John doe orders that mr.Jones be evicted and his house demolished, to make way for a "fine store, which would surely boost economic growth and provide jobs to our wonderful nation. Mr.Jones recieves little compensation for his home, and ends up becoming a hobo.
Of course, that hasn't happened, but it could easily happen with this law.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by timmy8586 on 2005-06-29 at 23:13:49
QUOTE(Shatter @ Jun 29 2005, 09:53 PM)
Timmy, you've obviously never moved, if you had, you would know that its not a "no problem thing", it takes several years to settle into a house and really consider it your home, also, the fact that there is simply no assurance that your property is in fact being confiscated for entirely legitmate reasons. This also brings up what you consider to be a legitimate reason, isn't the government  not supposed to get involved in private ventures. Confiscating property to benifit a corporate entity most definitly involves a private entity. This law seems to me like just another way for corrupt persons in the government to profit from creating laws that benifit companies they are affiliated with. Also, why do they have the right to evict you, its your property, not the governments, your property which you purchased with your own money, the government's involvment with it stops at property tax.
Heres an example scenario, John Doe is a government official who'se brother works for XYZ Shoes, he has several hundred shares of stock in XYZ shoes. Now, Mr.Jones lives in a house along a street often traveled, XYZ shoes would profit greatly from opening a store on that street, but there are no houses for sale. If XYZ shoes were to get a store along this street, their stock value would likly skyrocket.  John doe orders that mr.Jones be evicted and his house demolished, to make way for a "fine store, which would surely boost economic growth and provide jobs to our wonderful nation. Mr.Jones recieves little compensation for his home, and ends up becoming a hobo.
Of course, that hasn't happened, but it could easily happen with this law.
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I obviously haven't moved, huh? Thanks for filling me in on what's happened in my life, I sure am forgetful. It really is a no problem thing. Moving really isn't a big deal, especially if you stay in the same town. If people were seriously getting ripped off and getting underpaid then I'd think that people would gather and protest.

If by moving you they can give a generous boost to the economy, as I said, it's definitely worth it. You are just 1 person (maybe 3-4 in a house) but this could very well get 15+ people jobs, easy.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Dr.Shotgun on 2005-07-05 at 03:30:43
But seriously, that really removes your right to say "It's not for sale, bitch, now back off." What if the houes has sentimental value? I mean, the gov't should not be able to buy your house that easily.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Snake)Ling on 2005-07-05 at 06:24:07
Well, Timmy, the thing is, I have a right to own my house. It IS, after all, my house.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by rusell1993 on 2005-07-05 at 12:44:20
i agree. if something is urs then it is URS not a governments or nething.
it is so stupid.
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