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Default The Second Amendment Thread
This is obviously the crux of gun-control laws and issues in the United States today. If the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution protects individuals from government infringement of firearms, 90%+ of gun-control laws would be declared un-constitutional. The ACLU would have to get up off it's hind end and attack these laws. So, what exactly does the 2nd Amentment say?

"A well-regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State [nation, or country], the right of the People to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed."

Now in 2005 it reads more along the lines like this:

"A well-regulated Populace, being necessary to the security of a Socialist Police State, the right of the Government to regulate and ban Arms shall not be infringed."


Read the whole article, and then post what you think on it. I think it is very important to thouroughly understand the Bill of Rights before we recklessly invoke new laws and precepts.

I think the fore fathers were vague for a reason about this. Militias are why we are a country today, they played a HUGE role in the revolutionary war. I believe we as Americas should have the right to have/purchase any small arms. But just have major restrictions, such as massive back round check and etc.. The more powerfull the weapon, the harder it is to get.

Surely the right of the individual to own a gun shouldn't be above the rights of the people around him who do not wish to live near a man who owns a gun?

The easier the access to guns, the more gun crimes you're going to get. People are always going to commit crimes, but a gun is a powerful, powerful thing (even hand guns). Think about what a gun is, something that can take an arm, an eye, a leg, a person, a group of people, in a single pull of a trigger. Frankly, gun owners disgust me on their blatant disregard for the safety of humanity so that they can hold such a powerful device.

Switzerland! The land where every house has an automatic rifle in it.

Im going to try and be neutrel and produce opinions that may not be my own, just so we can have a pleasant debate.

On Topic:

Most gun owners are extremely strick about their weapons and most only use it for sport shooting and at the range.

Many other devices we have can do the same to a human body, and remember, its a human who pulls that trigger, not the gun. If guns kill people then I could blame miss spelled words on my pencil. (or keyboard )

Guns are the reason why you have the freedoms you have today.

Other people who don't like guns should just deal with the fact that it is a free country, and just becuase they don't like something doesn't mean that should effect every one.

ya switzerland... nice country went there in april. starting at 18 every male has an interval of 3 years in the army 3 years civilian and so on till retirement. They get to hold automatic rifles in their homes, and keep them when they retire. So practically every house has at least 1. Then they have procedures to collapse the tunnels if invaded. They have SAM sites in the mountains. Its crazy how good their system of defense is.


uh ya a knife can too. cut an arm off, poke out your eye, cut off your leg, kill a person, and kill a group. Any weapon can do that.

switzerland is a neutral country though so we don't have to worry about them

I support gun ownership cause i go deer hunting every year but i think that guns and their ammunition should be harder and more expensive to get a hold of. My idea would be that one has to order it off of the internet with a credit card which makes sure you are old enough (no more kids getting hold of a gun) and it also can help run an background check so they can see "Oh this person has been in jail 3 times already.... armed robbery.... participating in a murder..... grand theft auto..... hmmm i don't think we will sell him a glock"

Is anyone here going to argue that we need automatic rifles? Their sole purpose is to kill. People argue that "murderers are going to kill anyway." Firstly, keeping an automatc weapon out of their hands will reduce the number of people he can kill. Secondly, powerful weapons might look like a nice little escape. If he didn't own that gun, he might not have that easy way out to go on a rampage. I know this doesn't seem very organized, but I have to leave like right about now.

You make it seem like everyone who owns a weapon will go on a rampage and kill people. If you outlaw weapons entirely, the only civilians who will have them are the gangs who get them illegaly. So now they can just enter your home (with no way to defend your self) with weapons that you have might of had in order to scare them off (usual case).

Guns save lives just as much as taking them.

I have nothing against guns in general, but we don't need automatic weapons. Let people have their hunting rifles and pistols. They don't need M4 Carbines.

I personally don't like guns in general, but the Second Amendment was back in the days where Americas army was a drafted militia, not a volunteer force, and the lifting of the assault weapons ban is unreasonable. Maybe hunting weapons and small-arms should be allowed, (but restricted and with several modern safety locks) but the idea that a civilian should be allowed to purchase military assault-grade rifles and shotguns is ridiculous. For hunting? Oh yeah, you really need the HK MP5 to get those deer. For self-defense? Quick honey, get the AK-47, its Burglarpocalypse. Its quite ridiculous.

Exactly. There's no need for you to be walking around with an anti tank weapon. The 2nd admendment's purpose is to help balance the power between the people and the government. As long as we keep sniper rifles legal, I'm a happy guy. Cause someone will have to go oswald on some people down the road. If you know what I mean.

EDIT: One last thing. Just cause you make something illegal doesn't mean people can't get it anymore. If guns become illegal, it'll only restrict the average civilian from getting it, instead of the average criminal. Therefore actually GIVING power to the criminals.

Good Lord, the rednecks would start mounting guns on their trucks. You know they would. I can envision it, an America where Fords have mounted machine gun turrets. It's not as if it would make the trucks any more dangerous to other vehicles, because just look at how much those 4 foot high bumpers are going to help compact cars when the drunk, just pulling out of the bar, crashes into the passing car.

With a machine gun turret. Can't forget the turret

The 2nd amendment should not be abolished, if that is what you guys are talking about (I'm to lazy to read through this long ass post)

Civilians need guns, like it has been said before, to balance out the power between the government and the people.

If our government went awal, and tried to dictate us, we would have the power to have a rebellion to make the dication fall. This is what I believe the founding fathers wanted for us to have.

The power to make dictators fall. Because hell. They :censored:ing came from a dictatorship.

About 3 posts up, I've kinda already pointed that out. But then again, what I am saying? I bet i've done what you've done countless times. I usually don't read everyone's post.

That's not true. Studies have shown that when crimes in general go up, gun sales go up, but when gun sales go up, crime does not go up. So the amount of guns being sold has little to no effect on the amount of crimes.

Oh, and just like AlphaMC said, those who plan to use guns illegaly, buy them illegaly.

Yeah but let's say a decent, respectable guy want to kill a few people (don't tell me this doesn't happen). Would you rahter him have a handgun, or an M4? Assault weapons should be banned.

Still, the ability to kill is greatly increased by the weapon. I can kill you from a decent range with a gun, with a sniper rifle I can kill you from and extreme range and if I have a machine gun I can kill 20 of you. With a knife, your chances of survival are increased.

LMAO I want to see the wonderful friend who sold a sniper rifle to a regular smcuck. I seriously doubt they can in the U.S. But I agree with your point, obviously a bullet speeding at above mach is going to be impossible to dodge or run away from. The threat of a gun (fake ones that look real) is often much better. But I guess if real guns were banned you might see criminals taking chances and assuming the weapon is fake.

As far as I know, civillians are far too incompetent to handle guns.

At the time when the founding fathers made the constitution, guns were a lot simpler then. There wasn't the AK47, or any portable automatics. Perhaps the founding fathers weren't thinking about the future, and people took their words too far?

I can tell you right now, I would probably need an Ak 47/M4 to go hunting. Im a terrible shot and need all the bullets I can get

"LOOK! THERES ONE!!!! FIRE!!!!" *Pulls out machine gun and fires randomly at the deer, trees and bushing callapse from all the bullets* (similar to the scene in 'Predator')

Yea, we need weapons to in order to defend our own country, defend our selfs, and defeat our own government if it becomes too tyrannical. We have a constituational right to revolt! How cool is that?