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Staredit Network -> StarCraft Editing Related -> Randomization and Defense
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Carlsagan43 on 2006-02-11 at 23:45:31
By adding in Randomization, you add an element not idely used by todays defense maps. It has only been used off and on in a few maps today, and I think it could be big. Though the users of Bnet are not usually smart enough to really consider how randomization works on a defense map, it can be altered so that randomness can be the key to winning the map, not just an extra add in feature.

Generally speaking, the main components that decide the out come of a well balanced game are the mapside factors and the userside factors. Userside, is the group of factors that the player of the map can change as to increase his chances of winning in a game. These include strategic placement of his infantry and knowledge of how shop items work. Mapside, would be the functions of the map that can change based on gameplay. By combining these together you can decide the outcome of a map. It can be very unbalanced, incredibly easy or difficult, or even nonfunctioning.

Randomization is a factor that is mapside, and changes the way a game is each time it is played. By editing things such as enemy HP and Spawns you can make the game more difficult or easy based upon this randomization. This has an appealing factor since your success on one game may be failure under a different setting. This means that the game can chnage itself which presents intrigue to the players of the map. Maps that are repetitive, even if very interesting the first time, will eventually succumb to becoming boring. By adding in randomization, you keep the gameplay different for each game, thus making it interesting to play each time, or for at least a longer time.

Examples of randomization would include features like changing the amount of minerals you gain per kill, level length, level spawns, and so on. The idea of a map being able to reprogram itself into something different is a good concept, but does need to be implemented correctly. This can be seen in such things as "casino" type maps. Casino maps are maps where the randomization, a mapside factor, can be somewhat controled by the player, a userside factor. By adding these two together into one unique function, you have made the map not only self changing for each play, but also made it so that the user is really in control of a map to an extent. By having the user in control, the map becomes the way anymap should be, decided based on the skill of the player. Randomization allows us to have varying gameplay, with a user controlled success rate. The user is still in control of the out come of the map, with the map chnaging each time it is played.

I think casino maps are the way to go. They add in too much appeal for map "fun-ness" and make it interesting. Maps need to be interesting everytime they are played, but decided based on the players of the map. These are the ideas that make up other very fun games in real life. Poker, which is very popular, has many of the concepts of casino style maps. It is not solely based on randomization, but on the skill of the player. By implenting already thought out and proven ideas in games into maps, you can make sure that your map has similar success.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Wing-of-no-Wing on 2006-02-12 at 13:38:49
There's a big difference between randomizing how something plays, and randomizing how hard it is. Randomizing how hard it is means that the game becomes less dependant on player skill, which is bad. Randomizing how it plays, on the other hand, means that the adaptiveness and improvisational skills of the players are tested, which would make it more interesting. So, rather than having a level X that requires strategy Y to defeat, you could have levels X1, X2, X3, etc, chosen at random, requiring either strategy A, B, C, etc., so that the player would have to figure out what to do and implement it on the fly. That would be much more interesting than simply randomizing the difficulty, which could be rather annoying.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by 5(U) on 2006-02-13 at 22:28:25
QUOTE(carlsagan43 @ Feb 11 2006, 11:45 PM)
By adding in Randomization, you add an element not idely used by todays defense maps.  It has only been used off and on in a few maps today, and I think it could be big.  Though the users of Bnet are not usually smart enough to really consider how randomization works on a defense map, it can be altered so that randomness can be the key to winning the map, not just an extra add in feature. 

Generally speaking, the main components that decide the out come of a well balanced game are the mapside factors and the userside factors.  Userside, is the group of factors that the player of the map can change as to increase his chances of winning in a game.  These include strategic placement of his infantry and knowledge of how shop items work.  Mapside, would be the functions of the map that can change based on gameplay.  By combining these together you can decide the outcome of a map.  It can be very unbalanced, incredibly easy or difficult, or even nonfunctioning. 

Randomization is a factor that is mapside, and changes the way a game is each time it is played.  By editing things such as enemy HP and Spawns you can make the game more difficult or easy based upon this randomization.  This has an appealing factor since your success on one game may be failure under a different setting.  This means that the game can chnage itself which presents intrigue to the players of the map.  Maps that are repetitive, even if very interesting the first time, will eventually succumb to becoming boring.  By adding in randomization, you keep the gameplay different for each game, thus making it interesting to play each time, or for at least a longer time.

Examples of randomization would include features like changing the amount of minerals you gain per kill, level length, level spawns, and so on.  The idea of a map being able to reprogram itself into something different is a good concept, but does need to be implemented correctly.  This can be seen in such things as "casino" type maps.  Casino maps are maps where the randomization, a mapside factor, can be somewhat controled by the player, a userside factor.  By adding these two together into one unique function, you have made the map not only self changing for each play, but also made it so that the user is really in control of a map to an extent.  By having the user in control, the map becomes the way anymap should be, decided based on the skill of the player.  Randomization allows us to have varying gameplay, with a user controlled success rate.  The user is still in control of the out come of the map, with the map chnaging each time it is played.

I think casino maps are the way to go.  They add in too much appeal for map "fun-ness" and make it interesting.  Maps need to be interesting everytime they are played, but decided based on the players of the map.  These are the ideas that make up other very fun games in real life.  Poker, which is very popular, has many of the concepts of casino style maps.  It is not solely based on randomization, but on the skill of the player.  By implenting already thought out and proven ideas in games into maps, you can make sure that your map has similar success.
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btw this isnt new.. i made many maps that are known to be played without random stuff..

random bound, random def, etc..

but i never finished any of em..

the bound one was a very good idea.. but i suck at bounds.. so my obs would suck.. i should make this with a good bound maker.. ohh r2b just logged on my msn (im serious this is kinda weird)

i might remake it
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Rantent on 2006-02-14 at 01:08:34
Well... I've had a thought for a random defence. It was probably he most different defence ever. Basically the players couldn't attack, and they had to quickly set up their position to guide the enemies into a randomized blast. (I never came close to finishing it, so if anyone would like to pick up some weird task, slap their name on it and get credit, feel free to ask me.)
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