Report, edit, etc...Posted by V0lcom on 2006-09-03 at 18:52:59
I am starting up again making maps. I haven't done
anything for like a year to a year and a half.
But I want to start back up again.
Which editors are the best,
I will probably DL them all, but
which is easiest and most fit to use.
Seems like these days nobody is using SCXE,
but most it seems like Scm Draft 2 if I'm not correct.
1: Which editor should be used for triggers?
2: For terrain?
3: For anything else you can think of?
Help is appreciated.
*NOTE* I also have looked at triggers and
seeing the NEW ways people are organizing,
and it seems like people aren't really using
much of switches but death counts? Does
this make the triggers run faster or what?
anything for like a year to a year and a half.But I want to start back up again.
Which editors are the best,
I will probably DL them all, but
which is easiest and most fit to use.
Seems like these days nobody is using SCXE,
but most it seems like Scm Draft 2 if I'm not correct.
1: Which editor should be used for triggers?
2: For terrain?
3: For anything else you can think of?
Help is appreciated.
*NOTE* I also have looked at triggers and
seeing the NEW ways people are organizing,
and it seems like people aren't really using
much of switches but death counts? Does
this make the triggers run faster or what?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Falkoner on 2006-09-03 at 19:02:18
QUOTE
Falkoner
Starforge has an annoying trigger system, good terrain (Like with the clutter %), Locking, although it isn't that good, Player color changing, Fine breifing, and sprites, bad map resizing(pretty messed up, like the anywhere location stays same size), word coloring
SCMDraft2 has Copy/cut/paste, good unit making, good trigger copying(doesn't copy triggers to bottom on list) Multiple windows, okay trigger system, other sprites(although why would you need optical flare grenade!?), pretty good terrain, Pretty bad mission breifings, and good map resizing, also player color changing.
SCXE has almost no bugs when used alone, bad terrain, no complete stacking, no snap to grid, good simple trigger system, good mission breifings, no player color changing(It will actually change colors back if you use it after they have been changed), No sprites, good unit name changing, good word coloring, and no map resizing and no null.
Staredit has, well, you know, not much, its got a simple trigge editor, mission breifings, no stack, no color changing, auto snap to grid, okay it pretty much is useless except for the grid snapping if you're not using scmdraft2 or starforge.
Thing about using editors together, is that scxe and staredit work together fine, but when you use them with one of the other 2, problems will ensue, not always though, just try to use one for one thing and another for another thing, dont try to have 2 do the same thing
Starforge has an annoying trigger system, good terrain (Like with the clutter %), Locking, although it isn't that good, Player color changing, Fine breifing, and sprites, bad map resizing(pretty messed up, like the anywhere location stays same size), word coloring
SCMDraft2 has Copy/cut/paste, good unit making, good trigger copying(doesn't copy triggers to bottom on list) Multiple windows, okay trigger system, other sprites(although why would you need optical flare grenade!?), pretty good terrain, Pretty bad mission breifings, and good map resizing, also player color changing.
SCXE has almost no bugs when used alone, bad terrain, no complete stacking, no snap to grid, good simple trigger system, good mission breifings, no player color changing(It will actually change colors back if you use it after they have been changed), No sprites, good unit name changing, good word coloring, and no map resizing and no null.
Staredit has, well, you know, not much, its got a simple trigge editor, mission breifings, no stack, no color changing, auto snap to grid, okay it pretty much is useless except for the grid snapping if you're not using scmdraft2 or starforge.
Thing about using editors together, is that scxe and staredit work together fine, but when you use them with one of the other 2, problems will ensue, not always though, just try to use one for one thing and another for another thing, dont try to have 2 do the same thing
This topic has been asked before, and this is the same anwser I gave last time
Oh ya, and for your last question, no, it doesn't make it faster, but death counters don't use strings and allow easier randomization.
Also, if you would like to see the whole topic it's here
Topic
And, to also help you, a ncie way to copy triggers quickly is to use scmdraft2, copy all the triggers out of your list that you want, paste them into a word proccessing program, then use the find and replace to find things like Player 1 and replace them with things like Player 2
Report, edit, etc...Posted by MoonlighTurtle on 2006-09-03 at 19:45:12
SCMDraft2 is basically all you need to make a map.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by xmrxsiegecopx on 2006-09-03 at 19:51:03
QUOTE(MoonlighTurtle @ Sep 3 2006, 04:44 PM)
SCMDraft2 is basically all you need to make a map.
[right][snapback]555301[/snapback][/right]
[right][snapback]555301[/snapback][/right]
Though you may want to do the briefing first in X-tra; SCMD2 doesn't have a functional briefing editor.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by fritfrat(U) on 2006-09-03 at 20:02:22
Do briefing first thing in xtra, then do the rest of the map in scmdraft2.
Unless you're doing massive extended terrain; you may find starforge's brush pallettes very useful then.
Unless you're doing massive extended terrain; you may find starforge's brush pallettes very useful then.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by IsaT on 2006-09-03 at 20:39:38
If your a good typer, I would advise using Starforge for triggers. Although you do run the risk of currupting the map (make backups), its the best trigger editor I have seen.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by V0lcom on 2006-09-03 at 20:43:01
Thanks for all your help, it's really appreciated .
.Report, edit, etc...Posted by fritfrat(U) on 2006-09-03 at 20:54:42
Also, if you do a lot of your map in SCMDraft but didn't do briefing at start, then use starforge's briefing editor. Switching between SF and scmdraft isn't AS bad as switching between xtra and scmdraft.
And I personally think using trigedit's text in notepad with Replace All, Trigger Duplicator, or straight up using Trigedit would fufill all major copying needs, even if you don't know the syntax. Then for regular triggers, Classic Trigedit is great.
Everyone has their preferences, you'll just have to find out which you like more. Just remember to backup your maps no matter which ones you use
And I personally think using trigedit's text in notepad with Replace All, Trigger Duplicator, or straight up using Trigedit would fufill all major copying needs, even if you don't know the syntax. Then for regular triggers, Classic Trigedit is great.
Everyone has their preferences, you'll just have to find out which you like more. Just remember to backup your maps no matter which ones you use
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kenoli on 2006-09-03 at 20:58:59
QUOTE(fritfrat(U))
Also, if you do a lot of your map in SCMDraft but didn't do briefing at start, then use starforge's briefing editor. Switching between SF and scmdraft isn't AS bad as switching between xtra and scmdraft.
Switching from Scmdraft2 to X-tra to do the briefing (and nothing else) is perfectly fine.Report, edit, etc...Posted by Urmom(U) on 2006-09-03 at 21:02:12
That will screw up your strings though Kenoli. You can take the risk but it's not worth it.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by xmrxsiegecopx on 2006-09-03 at 21:05:41
Switching from SCMD2 to X-tra will also reset tank/goliath damage, delete all sprites, reset player colors, delete perfectly stacked units/buildings, etc, and may permanently damage strings. There have also been occurences where saving a map in X-Tra after SCMD2 will corrupt the map.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by LegacyWeapon on 2006-09-04 at 00:59:21
QUOTE(Urmom(U) @ Sep 3 2006, 09:01 PM)
That will screw up your strings though Kenoli. You can take the risk but it's not worth it.
[right][snapback]555347[/snapback][/right]
It shouldn't. Making a briefing makes new strings. Other strings are not edited, recycled, or unrecycled. I don't see what could go wrong.[right][snapback]555347[/snapback][/right]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-09-04 at 02:19:50
QUOTE(xmrxsiegecopx @ Sep 3 2006, 06:05 PM)
Switching from SCMD2 to X-tra will also reset tank/goliath damage, delete all sprites, reset player colors, delete perfectly stacked units/buildings, etc, and may permanently damage strings. There have also been occurences where saving a map in X-Tra after SCMD2 will corrupt the map.
[right][snapback]555349[/snapback][/right]
[right][snapback]555349[/snapback][/right]
Right. Starforge will do pretty much everything you need except isometric terrain. If you need that, I suggest doing terrain in SCMD2. I have never had any problems switching between the two at all, and I'm not sure where the rumors come from.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Owyn on 2006-09-04 at 06:54:12
i recommend ScmDraft and StarForge, use them both.
and another important tip for you,
make briefing FIRST of all using starforge, then SCmDraft for all other, and SF for sprites and spesefic propertitios like hp of minerals.
BUT, Starforge may corrupts maps too, f.e. it will probably reset unit prpertities all to 300 if it is something not normal for SF, but it wont if you are not going to use starforge for editing units and hero propertities from there.
no, but you can use same trigger with death counts for all players, it will only affect current player, but switch will affect all players.
and another important tip for you,
make briefing FIRST of all using starforge, then SCmDraft for all other, and SF for sprites and spesefic propertitios like hp of minerals.
BUT, Starforge may corrupts maps too, f.e. it will probably reset unit prpertities all to 300 if it is something not normal for SF, but it wont if you are not going to use starforge for editing units and hero propertities from there.
QUOTE
Does this make the triggers run faster or what?
no, but you can use same trigger with death counts for all players, it will only affect current player, but switch will affect all players.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Falkoner on 2006-09-04 at 09:29:17
What I usually do, although maybe I shouldn't, is I use scmdraft for just about everything but triggers and mission breifings, I also use it for copying triggers, since they are all in 1 big list, I use x-tra for triggers and mission breifs, although for certain things like p12 i make a backup then I use scmdraft to make triggers like that
The best soultion is to continually make backups
The best soultion is to continually make backups
Report, edit, etc...Posted by MoonlighTurtle on 2006-09-04 at 09:32:29
I find using SCXE over SCMD2 for triggers is pretty pointless when SCMD2 has the same classic trigedit which is just as good, if not better, than SCXE's trigger editor. It has the same look and feel, and one of the benefits is that it copies triggers under the original and not to the bottom of the list.
Then there's also the easy access to the powerful TrigEdit.
Then there's also the easy access to the powerful TrigEdit.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Falkoner on 2006-09-04 at 09:37:25
Yes, but the scmdraft 2 trigger editor is slighty less quick, like you have to look through a large list of every unit to find the one you want instead of a tree, it doesn't show renames of certain things, and alot of the time you have to press enter after you type in a new number or something, true, it does have a nice copy system, i already wrote that in my first post, but X-tra is just slightly faster for making many diffrent triggers, so Yes, if your map copies triggers alot use scmdraft2, if it has many unique triggers, use X-tra
Report, edit, etc...Posted by MoonlighTurtle on 2006-09-04 at 10:27:47
The fact that every unit isn't listed in a tree is another thing that makes SCMD2's classic trigger editor superior. You can simply type in the first letter or two of the unit name and it will automatically take you there. Also it DOES show the renaming of units in the list.
And when typing in a number pressing enter is faster than clicking okay in SCXE. SCMD2's classic editor just eliminates the okay option all together so all you have to do is hit enter.
Even if SCXE is somehow slightly faster at making triggers, that edge is lost when you need to switch to SCMD2 to snap units to grid, do square terrain, move triggers all the way up and down a list because you're copying it (SCMD2 just creates it under the original), place sprites, trigger conditions/actions applying to p9-12, place units for p9-12, put comps in the same force as a human player, etc.
And then when you switch from SCMD2 to SCXE, your sprites are lost, certain unit names reset, certain unit damages reset, risk of strings corrupting, and stacked units removed.
The small differences between SCXE's trigger editor and SCMD2's classic trigger editor only make SCMD2's editor better.
And when typing in a number pressing enter is faster than clicking okay in SCXE. SCMD2's classic editor just eliminates the okay option all together so all you have to do is hit enter.
Even if SCXE is somehow slightly faster at making triggers, that edge is lost when you need to switch to SCMD2 to snap units to grid, do square terrain, move triggers all the way up and down a list because you're copying it (SCMD2 just creates it under the original), place sprites, trigger conditions/actions applying to p9-12, place units for p9-12, put comps in the same force as a human player, etc.
And then when you switch from SCMD2 to SCXE, your sprites are lost, certain unit names reset, certain unit damages reset, risk of strings corrupting, and stacked units removed.
The small differences between SCXE's trigger editor and SCMD2's classic trigger editor only make SCMD2's editor better.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Falkoner on 2006-09-04 at 10:37:34
Well, thanks for telling me about typing in first 2 letters, didn't know that, I think it alot of it is preference, although after knowing about that I realize that scmdraft2 may be slighty faster, which now makes it my undeniable top map editor 
ADDITION:
Hey, V0lcom, think you could lock this topic? all that needs to be said has been said, the locking is on bottom left its a dropdown thingy...
ADDITION:
Hey, V0lcom, think you could lock this topic? all that needs to be said has been said, the locking is on bottom left its a dropdown thingy...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by fritfrat(U) on 2006-09-04 at 18:38:31
Actually, I have a question related to this, in that I may use starforge more if I figure this out. How do you make starforge not back up the map every 5 seconds or whatever the timer is? It always drives me crazy that my comp freezes for a couple seconds because it's a big map and takes a while to save.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kenoli on 2006-09-04 at 19:23:57
QUOTE(fritfrat(U))
How do you make starforge not back up the map every 5 seconds or whatever the timer is?
It is not an option.Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-09-05 at 01:10:16
If you computer can't handle backing up a map, I really think you could use a new computer...
How big is the map?
How big is the map?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by fritfrat(U) on 2006-09-05 at 16:02:55
My computer can handle backing up the map just fine, I just can't make an edit for 1-2 seconds every time it does it. Which is very often. And annoying. So I use scmdraft.
It's a 3 GHz machine with 1 gig ram, only a few years old, and considering how old starcraft is, I hardly blame a lack of computer power for it.
For every size map it does it for me where it bothers me significantly.. my most recent map is 130 KB uncompressed right now, and it was annoying just adding in the mission briefings.
It's a 3 GHz machine with 1 gig ram, only a few years old, and considering how old starcraft is, I hardly blame a lack of computer power for it.
For every size map it does it for me where it bothers me significantly.. my most recent map is 130 KB uncompressed right now, and it was annoying just adding in the mission briefings.