Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2006-12-27 at 04:09:13
I may not enjoy it much on principle, but I think that unless we can at least solve this downtime nonsense or get IP back, we should consider this. Namely, migrating to maplantis. I know that might be an issue for some of you, but we have to make a decision here. If this doesn't stop it's going to be a problem.
Truthfully, I'm not worried anymore about the matter of unprotection on principle or even that they're hosting known SEN dissidents like devilesk. I'm worried about whether the transition itself won't cause some damage. Likely most people will be reluctant to uproot as is, let alone for the above reasons. Not to mention SEN still has a fair amount of forum content and (until recently with the downtime, anyway) activity.
However, as I said, unless the downtime or IP's MIA problem can be solved, we need to make a decision. Should we put into effect a formal notice to begin migrating to maplantis? Or should we hold it out and let things happen as they will?
What are your thoughts?
Truthfully, I'm not worried anymore about the matter of unprotection on principle or even that they're hosting known SEN dissidents like devilesk. I'm worried about whether the transition itself won't cause some damage. Likely most people will be reluctant to uproot as is, let alone for the above reasons. Not to mention SEN still has a fair amount of forum content and (until recently with the downtime, anyway) activity.
However, as I said, unless the downtime or IP's MIA problem can be solved, we need to make a decision. Should we put into effect a formal notice to begin migrating to maplantis? Or should we hold it out and let things happen as they will?
What are your thoughts?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-12-27 at 04:55:22
I think you're insanely overreacting. To migrate would be to lose a good seventy percent of the community, whereas servers can be fixed.
It seems everyone thinks that the server being screwy is Armageddon or something.
The server is simply a machine. It can be replaced, and its glitches can be weathered. The community still seems to be going strong, and no event of the last 30 days has given me any reason to doubt the strength and faith of the community. If you've noticed, few SENers have been eager in the slightest to stomach some of the policies of maplantis. If we continue our present course, maplantis will most likely wither and die, or at least grow no further than its few devoted followers as of yet (we do have the first-on-google advantage).
Don't panic.
It seems everyone thinks that the server being screwy is Armageddon or something.
The server is simply a machine. It can be replaced, and its glitches can be weathered. The community still seems to be going strong, and no event of the last 30 days has given me any reason to doubt the strength and faith of the community. If you've noticed, few SENers have been eager in the slightest to stomach some of the policies of maplantis. If we continue our present course, maplantis will most likely wither and die, or at least grow no further than its few devoted followers as of yet (we do have the first-on-google advantage).
Don't panic.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Doodan on 2006-12-27 at 05:09:09
I agree with DTBK. Maplantis seems like a decent community, but we still dwarf it by far. I don't think it should be viewed as a competition between the two forums, as most of us have remained friends through everything. But Maplantis's mere existance is no reason to think SEN's usefulness is dwindling. Only time will tell, and it hasn't been long enough.
Good to be back, btw. ;p
Good to be back, btw. ;p
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2006-12-27 at 05:09:17
QUOTE(DT_Battlekruser @ Dec 27 2006, 04:55 AM)
I think you're insanely overreacting. To migrate would be to lose a good seventy percent of the community, whereas servers can be fixed.
It seems everyone thinks that the server being screwy is Armageddon or something.
The server is simply a machine. It can be replaced, and its glitches can be weathered. The community still seems to be going strong, and no event of the last 30 days has given me any reason to doubt the strength and faith of the community. If you've noticed, few SENers have been eager in the slightest to stomach some of the policies of maplantis. If we continue our present course, maplantis will most likely wither and die, or at least grow no further than its few devoted followers as of yet (we do have the first-on-google advantage).
Don't panic.
[right][snapback]606160[/snapback][/right]
It seems everyone thinks that the server being screwy is Armageddon or something.
The server is simply a machine. It can be replaced, and its glitches can be weathered. The community still seems to be going strong, and no event of the last 30 days has given me any reason to doubt the strength and faith of the community. If you've noticed, few SENers have been eager in the slightest to stomach some of the policies of maplantis. If we continue our present course, maplantis will most likely wither and die, or at least grow no further than its few devoted followers as of yet (we do have the first-on-google advantage).
Don't panic.
[right][snapback]606160[/snapback][/right]
I doubt that. They have the entirety of (U) there, for one. That takes away a lot of our more senior mappers.
To me, it's just a mapping site. The policies are really only a big deal if you're so inclined to butt heads with them. I think idiots like devilesk and LW sparked that stuff earlier, and now it's just playing into their hands to create a divide in the community where one doesn't need to be.
But without IP, how do you know if the site will come back? Doesn't he own the domain? What if he stops paying?
I don't want to live in that kind of limbo.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-12-27 at 05:13:19
IP is busy, not deserting us. If he wants to stop, he would tell us and give us a month or two, not just pull the plug randomly.
No offense to anyone, but that doesn't comprise very many people anymore.
It's a small community centered around OSMAP, a program that I and many others dislike. Why would maplantis ever attract new members from the faceless mass of internet users?
Like Doodan said, they're small and nothing to worry about right now. Time will tell, but if it weren't for the server glitch, we wouldn't even be considering this conversation.
QUOTE
They have the entirety of (U) there, for one.
No offense to anyone, but that doesn't comprise very many people anymore.
It's a small community centered around OSMAP, a program that I and many others dislike. Why would maplantis ever attract new members from the faceless mass of internet users?
Like Doodan said, they're small and nothing to worry about right now. Time will tell, but if it weren't for the server glitch, we wouldn't even be considering this conversation.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2006-12-27 at 05:16:44
It's not the server glitch so much as IP that's brought it about. The glitch was certainly the catalyst, though.
I think our first priority should be to get him to get his arse here to tell us what he intends to do. I saw him log in on my msn list a few days ago, messaged him, and got no reply. I don't think he's simply busy. I think he's pulling a Yoshi.
I think our first priority should be to get him to get his arse here to tell us what he intends to do. I saw him log in on my msn list a few days ago, messaged him, and got no reply. I don't think he's simply busy. I think he's pulling a Yoshi.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DevliN on 2006-12-27 at 05:48:59
I'm sure if need be, we could come up with enough money to get a new host for SEN - that shouldn't be an issue. I've already offered to help pay for a new host and everything to IP, but he declined - yet know that this offer still stands if the time comes.
And I agree with Tuxlar. He is on AIM right now, but doesn't respond to IMs. Its been like this for a few days. Then again, the holiday season is here so theoretically he could be busy with family stuff for the moment.
And I agree with Tuxlar. He is on AIM right now, but doesn't respond to IMs. Its been like this for a few days. Then again, the holiday season is here so theoretically he could be busy with family stuff for the moment.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2006-12-27 at 05:53:57
Yeah, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt until after new years. Or until the next major downtime. Then I'm gonna say we should start doing something.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Valug on 2006-12-27 at 11:13:38
[sub]Got ahold of IP on aim for a minute or so. Said his computer is dead and he does not know what to do. =/[/sub]
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kenoli on 2006-12-27 at 14:53:20
QUOTE(DT_Battlekruser)
No offense to anyone, but that doesn't comprise very many people anymore.
Anymore?Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mini Moose 2707 on 2006-12-27 at 16:48:39
If and when we relocate to Maplantis, SEN will definitely be up for any sort of transfers. However, I am going to try to rebuild SEN.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CheeZe on 2006-12-27 at 17:49:38
QUOTE
It's a small community centered around OSMAP, a program that I and many others dislike.
No, it's centered around open source mapping which, in my opinion, is a great idea. The OSMAP program was, at best, a lame attempt to get those who couldn't comprehend their idea to join their side.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CaptainWill on 2006-12-27 at 17:56:45
But I thought you were a supporter of map protection, CheeZe?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by CheeZe on 2006-12-27 at 18:00:37
I support map protection. That doesn't mean I can't support open source mapping, where the map is left unprotected by the creator for anyone to edit. If I remember, Tux used to do this.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2006-12-27 at 19:12:52
I still do, Cheeze. But I still respect (but cease to recommend) map protection.
But as I've already stated, it ultimately isn't that big a deal. It's only the respect issue that has people on edge. I think people like devilesk, DEAD, and LW (for creating OSMAP... possibly MA too) are the ones who are creating the problem with it.
But as I've already stated, it ultimately isn't that big a deal. It's only the respect issue that has people on edge. I think people like devilesk, DEAD, and LW (for creating OSMAP... possibly MA too) are the ones who are creating the problem with it.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-12-27 at 23:55:39
Yes, it's problems on both sides, but as long as Maplantis plays host to the horde of egotistical communists that are for using OSMAP to force their will on others, it holds no interest to me. SEN has its egotistical nutcases too, but our large member base dampens their obviousness.
I wish that were wholly so, but some of the attitude over there makes me want to think otherwise.
QUOTE
No, it's centered around open source mapping which, in my opinion, is a great idea. The OSMAP program was, at best, a lame attempt to get those who couldn't comprehend their idea to join their side.
I wish that were wholly so, but some of the attitude over there makes me want to think otherwise.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Tuxedo Templar on 2006-12-28 at 00:00:00
It's the obvious place for fallen SENers, so you really can't avoid encountering anti-SEN sentiment there (and visa versa here). The wiser ones know better, though, and choose not to engage in this nonsense.
For the time being, at least.
For the time being, at least.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2006-12-28 at 00:02:55
At least for now, all it has is fallen SENers, and for the most part, we don't ban people without reason.
It's not to say that everyone on Maplantis is bad, far from it, but there's a little too much ego on the loose there. Admittedly, most of it is develisk and Golden-Fist.
It's not to say that everyone on Maplantis is bad, far from it, but there's a little too much ego on the loose there. Admittedly, most of it is develisk and Golden-Fist.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Mini Moose 2707 on 2006-12-28 at 00:38:33
Well, whining about who does what and what they are isn't going to help anyone.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Doodle77(MM) on 2006-12-28 at 18:39:02
QUOTE(DT_Battlekruser @ Dec 28 2006, 12:02 AM)
At least for now, all it has is fallen SENers, and for the most part, we don't ban people without reason.
It's not to say that everyone on Maplantis is bad, far from it, but there's a little too much ego on the loose there. Admittedly, most of it is develisk and Golden-Fist.
[right][snapback]606469[/snapback][/right]
It's not to say that everyone on Maplantis is bad, far from it, but there's a little too much ego on the loose there. Admittedly, most of it is develisk and Golden-Fist.
[right][snapback]606469[/snapback][/right]
And Yoshi, of course.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by IsolatedPurity on 2006-12-29 at 03:31:24
This is my gf's computer... she can be on it at anytime and won't respond to you ;o