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Staredit Network -> Serious Discussion -> The Role Of Nuclear Weapons
Report, edit, etc...Posted by High on 2004-08-22 at 03:55:51
In a few topics, i ahve seen refernences to nuclear weapons, and i just thought of a dicussion topic.

We all know what nukes can do, its a pretty awsome power, but, dispite this, it has onyl ever been used twice. All the wars since WW2, all nuclear activity ahs been is a threat. I think that no country will ever use a nuke, the whle point of them are to scare others. Heres a smaller example

This guys asks your for some money,his mum is there, he threatens you with his uber tanky muscles, you knoe he wont punch you, because of his mother, but you still feel sacred and intimated, so you had it over. He never even has to swing at you, and he got what i wanted, you gave up on the thought of what he COULD do, not what he WOULD do.

Coutries use nukes the same way, a baragning tool, because they think what they COULD do, not what the WOULD do

Anyway, dicuss, flame, suggest, correct whatever
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Screwed on 2004-08-22 at 05:25:31
Once someone launches a nuke, everyone will start to launch one. North Korea never cared about his citizens, though they have hundred of radioactive weapons at hand. If it happened that USA wanted to get into North Korea's way and save their citizens, (like they did to Iraq) North Korea would just launch Earth to pieces. All of the world's nuclear weapon's power can cover the entire earth several times and enough to kill 100 billion, which means everyone on this planet is enough to die 20 times. (data few years ago - it must have been worse now.)
Report, edit, etc...Posted by ShadowSnipe4 on 2004-08-22 at 05:49:49
I think that nukes are just used to intimidate other countries. They're just the best mass killing weapon that everyone is afraid of so they are a major bagaining chip. The problem is that if one country launches a nuke then they all launch nukes and it basically destroys life as we know it. So the point of having nukes is not neccesarily to use them but to just scare people into thinking your going to use them enough so that you get what you want. What I think is that once people get a better weapon than nukes then those will be the next thing that all the countries of the world will stock up on and so the endless cycle of power struggles continues on for many generations until someone gets enough power to control the world.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TSoldier_Wol[f] on 2004-08-22 at 07:34:42
I'm sorry but I can't believe. I know 1 day a Nuke will get off. 1 day. When that day comes. The world will never be the same. Trust me.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by BeeR_KeG on 2004-08-22 at 09:50:25
QUOTE(TSoldier_Wol[f)
,Aug 22 2004, 07:34 AM] I'm sorry but I can't believe. I know 1 day a Nuke will get off. 1 day. When that day comes. The world will never be the same. Trust me.

Yup.

Nukes won't be used for sometime because fear of them. Look at Bush he said Saddam had nukes but we know all Saddam had was 3 sticks, a stone and an AK-47 to fight the americans.

But one dude will say: "I got more balls than you all", and he will launch a nuke.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kame on 2004-08-22 at 11:47:11
I want someone to nuke america. change their god damn world perspective.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by BeeR_KeG on 2004-08-22 at 11:54:57
You seem to change nationality each week.
You were Qatar(I think thats the flag, dark red(I don't know the color in english) and white), then iraq and now USA....?

I'm confused you go Us flag but you want them nuked...?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by mobomojo on 2004-08-22 at 12:54:39
QUOTE(FireKame @ Aug 22 2004, 07:47 AM)
I want someone to nuke america. change their god damn world perspective.

Ill go into that quote in a second.

Nukes are somewhat psychological; not all countries have them, nor do they have as much as the US. These nukes are capable of wiping out whole cities easily. Used in a densely populated area, that could means a million lives and much more.

As for nuking America, does anyone remember that one crisis? I think it was the Cuban Missile Crisis. Some conflict between the US and Russia over Cuba, and they were so damn close to being trigger happy and launching death on each other.

So you want someone to nuke America? Go ahead. But if you think theyre not going to launch any of their own, and theres going to be a LOT, in retaliation, youre not thinking far. They can launch enough nukes to probably take out Europe or more, and you think itll just "change their god damn world perspective". GJ, youve just started WWIII a few years ahead of schedule.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by ent on 2004-08-22 at 13:39:34
bah if some terrorist decides to nuke newyork, what can usa do in retaliation?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by BeeR_KeG on 2004-08-22 at 13:43:26
QUOTE(ent @ Aug 22 2004, 01:39 PM)
bah if some terrorist decides to nuke newyork, what can usa do in retaliation?

Al-Qaeda thought that when they crashed into the towers...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by mianmian on 2004-08-22 at 14:20:12
Well its true that nukes are mostly used as barganing chips but like someone mentioned if soem terrorsit or rebels set off a briefcase-nuke in some city. Whats gonna happen then and also i think the US has a counter-nucler missle defense systeme where they can shot down or disable teh nukes befre there anywhear to do damage cause i mean to shoot them it has to cross the ocean cause only Canada and USA are in North America...
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kame on 2004-08-22 at 14:41:47
QUOTE(mobomojo @ Aug 22 2004, 11:54 AM)
As for nuking America, does anyone remember that one crisis? I think it was the Cuban Missile Crisis. Some conflict between the US and Russia over Cuba, and they were so damn close to being trigger happy and launching death on each other.

Cuban Missle Crisis reminds me, anyone ever look at a map to see how closer Russia was to Alaska? No one seems to care...Alaska is not big enough for anything more than to enrage us, but if they ever wanted to take over america, Alaska is a good start.

QUOTE
You seem to change nationality each week.
You were Qatar(I think thats the flag, dark red(I don't know the color in english) and white), then iraq and now USA....?

I'm confused you go Us flag but you want them nuked...?


I'm American. I had the Qatar flag for awhile because I didn't know who you guys were, so I didn't want too much information out there. I changed to Iraq cause I have a very good guy friend over their right now. In actuality I am American, I'm just not as patriotic as most people, and I hope not as ignorant. I want the United States of America GONE, no matter what it takes. It would be nice to keep all the people alive, and just to over throw the government, but that doesn't seem to be an option for quite awhile

*as the FBI arrests her*
Report, edit, etc...Posted by DT_Battlekruser on 2004-08-22 at 14:47:27
QUOTE
bah if some terrorist decides to nuke newyork, what can usa do in retaliation?


Nuke them???
Report, edit, etc...Posted by BeeR_KeG on 2004-08-22 at 15:30:05
QUOTE
QUOTE 
You seem to change nationality each week.
You were Qatar(I think thats the flag, dark red(I don't know the color in english) and white), then iraq and now USA....?

I'm confused you go Us flag but you want them nuked...? 



I'm American. I had the Qatar flag for awhile because I didn't know who you guys were, so I didn't want too much information out there. I changed to Iraq cause I have a very good guy friend over their right now. In actuality I am American, I'm just not as patriotic as most people, and I hope not as ignorant. I want the United States of America GONE, no matter what it takes. It would be nice to keep all the people alive, and just to over throw the government, but that doesn't seem to be an option for quite awhile


Aight, that makes sense.


QUOTE
Well its true that nukes are mostly used as barganing chips but like someone mentioned if soem terrorsit or rebels set off a briefcase-nuke in some city. Whats gonna happen then and also i think the US has a counter-nucler missle defense systeme where they can shot down or disable teh nukes befre there anywhear to do damage cause i mean to shoot them it has to cross the ocean cause only Canada and USA are in North America...


US does have a counter attack system. They launch a missle(something like a Patriot) and the missile has lots of laser measuring things and it just slams into the other missle.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by mobomojo on 2004-08-22 at 15:34:44
Didnt the US invest millions, probably billions into a missile defense system that proved to be in a non-operational order at the current time it was tested? Or was that an older report?
Report, edit, etc...Posted by BeeR_KeG on 2004-08-22 at 15:36:06
That was probably an old report during the cold war.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Nozomu on 2004-08-22 at 16:35:27
Nuclear weapons are most effective these days as a deterrent. A country with a nuclear arsenal and the means to deliver it has an impenetrable diplomatic shield. When was the last time a country with nuclear capability was invaded? Never. It seems that nuclear weapons are a terrific way of keeping the peace. If every country had nukes, there would be no more large-scale wars. The only scary part is that dangerous, crazy people sometimes come into power (like Kim Jong-Il of North Korea), who are mentally unbalanced and don't use rational judgement. They're the kind of people who would launch a nuke and wipe out humanity.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by .matrix//Merovingian on 2004-08-22 at 20:06:40
QUOTE(Nozomu @ Aug 22 2004, 03:35 PM)
Nuclear weapons are most effective these days as a deterrent.  A country with a nuclear arsenal and the means to deliver it has an impenetrable diplomatic shield.  When was the last time a country with nuclear capability was invaded?  Never.  It seems that nuclear weapons are a terrific way of keeping the peace.  If every country had nukes, there would be no more large-scale wars.  The only scary part is that dangerous, crazy people sometimes come into power (like Kim Jong-Il of North Korea), who are mentally unbalanced and don't use rational judgement.  They're the kind of people who would launch a nuke and wipe out humanity.

I agree wholeheartedly. Nukes are most effective as deterrents. Even if their use would be justified, nukes should be used only as a last resort (kinda like the cards Armageddon and Wrath of God in Magic: the Gathering).


QUOTE
US does have a counter attack system. They launch a missle(something like a Patriot) and the missile has lots of laser measuring things and it just slams into the other missle.


Anti-ballistic missile systems are horrifyingly unreliable against the very weapons they are supposed to take out, so they shouldn't be relied upon as an effective defense.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by TSoldier_Wol[f] on 2004-08-22 at 23:46:49
When 1 nuke goes off later in the future. Everyone will be runing around. Goverment will send the President to either theses Bases. Area 51(JK) For reals they will send the President to the Rocky Mountains in Colorado. The base is inside the Mountains. The name of the base is called "Norad". Norad is the heaviest Base that the Americans built. Rumers say "Norad is so heavy defended/Armored enough to with stand a Nuclear Exploastion" Norad is where the Airports report when a UFO slightings. I heard before that Norad can even hack into our Phones systems and could hack into E-mails as well too. Thats just a Rumer I recall. Norad was built for Air Defense Systems. Norad is heavy Defend on ground as well too. They have Heilcopter Partols I hear too. If they spot ya. They'll either tell you to go back or they'll shoot at ya. Oh well back to the Nukes. After the President is safe. People will either be hidding in their Basements or Underground Sheds. But most of the People will run to a Miltary Base. Theres going to be alot of censored.gif happening when a nuke goes off in the world. After war is deleared. The War will be over within 5 mins or later. Life will be cheap when a Nuclear War does off and ends. After a Nuclear War is over. Most of the Survivors will be killed off by Nuclear Winter. Thats all I can say for right now.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Kame on 2004-08-23 at 00:39:03
QUOTE(TSoldier_Wol[f)
,Aug 22 2004, 10:46 PM] When 1 nuke goes off later in the future. Everyone will be runing around. Goverment will send the President to either theses Bases. Area 51(JK) For reals they will send the President to the Rocky Mountains in Colorado. The base is inside the Mountains. The name of the base is called "Norad". Norad is the heaviest Base that the Americans built. Rumers say "Norad is so heavy defended/Armored enough to with stand a Nuclear Exploastion" Norad is where the Airports report when a UFO slightings. I heard before that Norad can even hack into our Phones systems and could hack into E-mails as well too. Thats just a Rumer I recall. Norad was built for Air Defense Systems. Norad is heavy Defend on  ground as well too. They have Heilcopter Partols I hear too. If they spot ya. They'll either tell you to go back or they'll shoot at ya. Oh well back to the Nukes. After the President is safe. People will either be hidding in their Basements or Underground Sheds. But most of the People will run to a Miltary Base. Theres going to be alot of  censored.gif  happening when a nuke goes off in the world. After war is deleared. The War will be over within 5 mins or later. Life will be cheap when a Nuclear War does off and ends. After a Nuclear War is over. More of the Survivors will be killed off by Nuclear Winter. Thats all I can say for right now.

lol, that'll be good. get all the targets in the same state. They'll go for the silos up here too. Norad is teh r0xx0rs!

my school is a bomb shelter. I just thought I should put that in
Report, edit, etc...Posted by mobomojo on 2004-08-23 at 00:47:24
QUOTE(Nozomu @ Aug 22 2004, 12:35 PM)
Nuclear weapons are most effective these days as a deterrent.  A country with a nuclear arsenal and the means to deliver it has an impenetrable diplomatic shield.  When was the last time a country with nuclear capability was invaded?  Never.  It seems that nuclear weapons are a terrific way of keeping the peace.  If every country had nukes, there would be no more large-scale wars.  The only scary part is that dangerous, crazy people sometimes come into power (like Kim Jong-Il of North Korea), who are mentally unbalanced and don't use rational judgement.  They're the kind of people who would launch a nuke and wipe out humanity.


Yup, I gotta agree with this. And to go a bit more into that, its only scary when those nukes are actually fired.


As for that mass jumble of words about Norad...

QUOTE
North American Aerospace Defense Command
"Deter, Detect, Defend." That is the motto of the men and women who serve in the North American Aerospace Defense Command. Since 1958, Canadians and Americans have been partners in protecting the airspace of Alaska, Canada and the contiguous 48 United States. The mission has evolved over the years.

Until the morning of Sept. 11, 2001, NORAD's focus was almost exclusively fixed on threats coming toward the Canadian and American borders, not terrorism in our domestic airspace. Because of that day, NORAD's focus has increased to include domestic airspace. NORAD's mission is truly global.

Prior to Sept. 11, NORAD was a word that was associated predominately with the Cold War. The eyes and ears of NORAD were focused on aerospace threats that may come from sources far away from the shores of Canada and the United States.

Today, the highly skilled men and women of NORAD use ground-based radar, airborne radar, satellites, fighter aircraft, proven command structures and intelligence capabilities to enforce control of the skies over the United States and Canada.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Helios on 2004-08-23 at 01:12:42
QUOTE
All of the world's nuclear weapon's power can cover the entire earth several times and enough to kill 100 billion, which means everyone on this planet is enough to die 20 times. (data few years ago - it must have been worse now.)


very few nuclear weapons have been built in the past few years. The United States alone could blanket the entire earth 10 times with nuclear warheads, Russia could do it 7 times over, China 3.



A little note bomb shelters only do any good if you are up to 20 miles away from the detonation point of a nuclear weapon. Anything closer will either be vaporized or killed within minutes from the radiation. Norad is the only complex that could survive a direct nuclear attack. (its inside a freakin mountain) Yes TSoldier_Wold Norad can hack into your e-mails and phone systems, then again any person at one of the agencies (FBI,CIA,NSA) can do that also.

QUOTE
QUOTE
Didnt the US invest millions, probably billions into a missile defense system that proved to be in a non-operational order at the current time it was tested? Or was that an older report?
That was probably an old report during the cold war.


Its an old report but there is no difference in the situation now, there is no way to stop a nuclear attack.

QUOTE
US does have a counter attack system. They launch a missle(something like a Patriot) and the missile has lots of laser measuring things and it just slams into the other missle.


Yes that was a proposed idea I saw it in a Popular Mechanic magazine. This still has not yet been setup though.

QUOTE
Cuban Missle Crisis reminds me, anyone ever look at a map to see how closer Russia was to Alaska? No one seems to care...Alaska is not big enough for anything more than to enrage us, but if they ever wanted to take over america, Alaska is a good start.


There are military bases in Alaska you know. Also alaska is quite big enough to enrage us considering its the largest state. (take that texas )


Terrorists with Suitcase nukes ?, Ive heard of the concept but its not very likely. Because you see for one no matter how much money they might get no one likes terrorists no matter how corrupt a nation is. So theses terrorists could never get their "hands" on any military grade plutonium to even make the bomb.

Then there is the problem of getting it into the country, because they sure arent going to get any plutonium in the states.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Nozomu on 2004-08-23 at 01:54:42
Oh come on, how easy would it be to sneak a little case of plutonium into America from the west coast? It's not like we guard the whole Pacific coast tenaciously. I bet a terrorist in a rowboat could smuggle in plutonium by landing on an isolated beach. Also, it would be easy to get through customs if like 30 terrorists each swallowed a lead pill (wrapped in a condom, of course, to prevent lead poisoning) which contained plutonium. Reassemble 'em later at some secret lab and BAM! It gets kicked up a notch.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Helios on 2004-08-23 at 02:04:24
Well you see plutonium gives off a little something called radiation. To prevent themselves from dying from the plutonium before they could deliver it, you need protective materials for that.
Report, edit, etc...Posted by Nozomu on 2004-08-23 at 02:12:32
Lead. Stops. Radiation.
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